I've been using the Predator tuner for a while and figure it's time to try some data logging, but could use a little help on what I should be looking for and what it all means.

I know that a lot of people talk about KNK ST and LT. I understand we are talking about short term and long term knock and I assume we would like for it to be zero? But at what point does it become a concern? or if you are getting knock period should you do something about it.

If you get a reading of KNK ST Retard 1, does that mean the computer has backed your timing off by 1 degree?

Finally if you are getting knock, I would assume you can cure it by adding enough octane to your fuel (an additive like Torco or some race fuel) or by increasing the Fuel setting.

Any input from those in the know would be appreciated.

You ask valid questions.
Yes on your question, as the log shows 1 deg St Knk, yes it pulled one deg.
LT Knk is a much bigger issue. You never want a LT knk issues. LT knk has to happen in the same spot in time in a longer time as did previous to cause the LT knk.
Its so much easyer to use Trinity for loging, while driving with ST and LT knk screens being up I can see as I drive how, when, where and why ST LT knk comes and goes.
Most only look at knk at WOT. Its where the damage is done at high rpm and needs attention to correct the issue. Where its most important at wot.
I will write this to show knk and pulling timing happens besides at wot. And hurts nothing beacuse of the pcm capabilties.
Your PCM pulls timing all the time all over the rpm range, as you just drive around.

EXAMPLE: If going up an incline, your in too high a gear and lug the motor, with a six speed or an auto in auto stick. You dont down shift or (auto) dont down shift on its own, you lug it. Look, you will see knk and pull a couple deg of timing right in front of your eyes. Not a problem, what its supposed to do. Unlike in the 70s when in a stick car or truck being in too high a gear and mashing the gas,,,,it starts to sound like a diesel,,,thats KNK. And back then, knk just hammered until you shifted, or got out of the gas. Now days the PCM dumps timing to protect the motor. END EXAMPLE ::
Knowing where your timing is coming from is important. Just so you know knk can come at any rpm or throttle preasure.
WOT is diffrent and having knk as I mentioned above, here comes the damage.
Many, just throw fuel at the knk. Add fuel, Like a band aid. Then where is your AF ratio after adding fuel if you dont have an af gauge ? You dont know.
May be better to take out a deg of timing to get knk out. I dont worry about pulling a deg of timing. 3 or 4 deg is a diffrent story. If I have 4 deg knk timing being pulled, my a/f is at 11.2 I wont add fuel. Ill take out 3 deg of timing not 4, at the rpm range Im seeing it pulled by pcm.
I seen Knk from not enough timing and too much fuel. Set up for my SC tune. I found and have a good tuner straighten it out for me. (see sig)
Junk fuel will cause knk, you cant tune, not worth even trying wot runs.
Whats the diffrence in the canned 91oct tune and 93oct tune. Most, is Timing and timing curve, A/f commands. And other stuff I dont know.
Being said, the 93 tune has more timing, so you need better fuel above 93 octane to utilize the extra timing. To get more HP without having knk you must have the higher octane rating.

Look into your logs. Whats the ambient, IAT, maniflod temp, exhaust temp, A/F ratio, Throttle opening%, where does the cmr software have your timing at Actucal and Base timing, That info will be in your collected data pid logs. Once you see it working you start to understand more and can make changes.
My advice, get the tools. A/F wideband is a must. Stand alone or Trinity with the wideband. Neither Trinity or Preditor give a/f readings without a added wideband. As we do need them. Our cars have narrowband o2s and when in open loop WOT the cmr command is where your a/f comes from not the 02s. Thery are for idle and part throttle only. Hunting for 14.4 continously, for emmisions and MPG.

Hope this helps understand,,,FlatTop

Thanks for your input on data loging. You have both helped explain and given me more to think about. I might have to invest in a few more tools if I want to get serious about this stuff, thanks again for your insight. :thumbsup:

So 4.5 short term knock is not good.

dcantrall, depends where it was, and how you got it. If you were at WOT making a hit, anywhere through the rpm range,,,, its Not good.
Look at your logs and see where it happened. Or send them to me I can look for ya. Soon as I get back. I will be heading out in the morning for 6 days Bear hunting.

70baracuda, You will need the righ stuff. I see you are wanting more by the way your on the foum,,lol lol I see where your at on CT grooming information,,, to go faster. You been biten by the bug, nothing you can do now,,, but add HP !!!!!! its ok, happens to many of us.
FlatTop

70baracuda, You will need the righ stuff. I see you are wanting more by the way your on the foum,,lol lol I see where your at on CT grooming information,,, to go faster. You been biten by the bug, nothing you can do now,,, but add HP !!!!!! its ok, happens to many of us.
FlatTop

I was bit once before back in the early 80's and it was rumored I was cured sometime in the early 90's. But it was there always there lurking in the back ground even if I wouldn't admit it, then Dodge had to go and make the Challenger again. Now I have to figure out how to work with all this modern tech., I liked it when I just needed a screw driver, a timing light and a piece of chalk LOL.

Good luck on your Bear hunt.