Persistent problems starting

[SRT8 Challenger]

My Nov 2012 delivery Challenger SRT8 has had various problems over it's 40k KM life. First repeated issues with the connector on the passenger seat airbag sensor, which was finally fixed after 5 visits to the dealer to replace harness, by soldering the wires together as the connectors sent were constantly wrong from Dodge parts (mislabeled little used part in the warehousing system probably).

Another problem with various dash light codes and would disappear after restarting the car. The only one diagnosed was the radio dropping off the internal network for a few seconds.

Currently I have had I think 4 incidents of starting problems. Car is warm and shutoff for 10-20 minutes.
Press Start button and engine starts to crank, and crank and crank for about 20 seconds before stopping without firing.

No dash codes just cranking with 0 firing. Same thing for 2-3 tries. Wait 10 minutes and it starts up and runs strong.

The latest incident involved remote starting which was a first.

Remote started ok. Entered car and pressed brake/start button and car did not enable. Did this 3 times, still nothing. So now the car is running, can't be enabled and can't be shutoff (tried to hold in the start button for a while). Used the remote start on keychain and turned it off. Now press the start button and and again 20 seconds of cranking (as above but this time with a small little attempt to fire at the beginning) then nothing. Does this 3 times in a row. 5 minute break then it fires right up and is fine.

After the 3rd issue they replaced the fuel pump relay as a "guess" but they have no idea.

Supposed to get a call back tomorrow after they call engineering again.

Anyone else having this 20 seconds of cranking with no firing issue?

Same Shell premium gas all the time at a station I have been going too for 10+ years.

These trips to the dealership and loaner cars are growing tiring.

One more question for a first time keyless car. It was my understanding that holding in the Start button for an extended period should shutdown the car just like turning off a physical key. Is this true? It would not shut off in the example I provided above of the last issue I had. Kind of scary if the throttle gets stuck on this beast.

SRT8 Challenger

[RobF]

I had the crank problem on my 2012 SRT (August 2011 delivery) when I first got the car, and I know that this might sound silly, but it was actually my fault, and I'm wondering if it might be the same thing that you're doing. I have a small car collection which includes a carburated car, so I'm kinda used to giving the throttle a push when I turn a car over. I was doing just that when I was starting my SRT, and it actually flooded the engine, resulting in the crank/no fire issue. Have you tried starting the car without having your foot on the gas? Like I said, it sounds silly, but as soon as I stopped doing it, the issue never reoccurred.

Also, your car is obviously a daily driver if you've put 40k on it in a year. Mine is a Sunday driver, and as such it hasn't been getting much wear and tear. Not saying a $50k car is supposed to have the problems you're having, but 40k in 12 months is a healthy amount of milage, and things can, and will go wrong with a daily driver over time.

Good luck, man. I hope you get everything sorted out.

- Rob

[SRT8 Challenger]

Thanks for the post RobF

I also grew up with many a carb'd car and probably the last 10-12 have been FInjection. Not touching the throttle at all during these incidents. It will be interesting what engineering tells the dealer to try next.

I am located in Canada so the 40K is in kilometers not miles so in US terms you are looking at about 24K miles at this point.

Yes a daily driver for me. I am fortunate enough to be a Chrysler supplier living just across the border from Detroit so I spend a lot of time driving back and forth.

[ChallengerJim]

Have you tried removing the start button and inserting the key fob and starting it that way?
Almost sounds like the fob isn't being detecetd correctly. Especially since you could start it remotely. Do you have anything else on the keychain with your fob? I know the car should say "No FOB Detecetd" but.....

[SRT8 Challenger]

I have not tried inserting the key during these cranking incidents.

The dash does not report the fob being missing at the time.

The dealer has ordered and received the wireless/key detection module and has it in to replace it but I have to run off to Mexico for a week for work so that won't happen for a bit.

One theory, and they say they have seen this before with a SRT8 Jeep is interference from other transmitters from other vehicles. Frequently this Jeep would not start. Turned out to be something from the Toyota parked in the garage next too it.

The only part that does not fit was in these cases it would not turn over. Mine cranks but doesn't fire.

We will see what that part does for me.

[Hal H]

Originally Posted by SRT8 Challenger

Currently I have had I think 4 incidents of starting problems. Car is warm and shutoff for 10-20 minutes.
Press Start button and engine starts to crank, and crank and crank for about 20 seconds before stopping without firing.

No dash codes just cranking with 0 firing. Same thing for 2-3 tries. Wait 10 minutes and it starts up and runs strong.

Anyone else having this 20 seconds of cranking with no firing issue?

One more question for a first time keyless car. It was my understanding that holding in the Start button for an extended period should shutdown the car just like turning off a physical key. Is this true? It would not shut off in the example I provided above of the last issue I had. Kind of scary if the throttle gets stuck on this beast.

Your crank - no start system sounds like the classic example of a Crank Position Sensor going bad - when they get hot, the circuit goes open and given a short cool-down, they'll work again.

Usually, it requires holding the Start button in for two seconds (I've done this on mine to test it while in motion) and it shuts down.

You may need a re-flash of the WIN node to see if that restores the shut-down function as it should be.

[Flygirl]

Originally Posted by RobF

Also, your car is obviously a daily driver if you've put 40k on it in a year...Not saying a $50k car is supposed to have the problems you're having, but 40k in 12 months is a healthy amount of milage, and things can, and will go wrong with a daily driver over time.

I feel like 40k miles is just a bit over getting it broken in, at least these days.

[Yellow Jacket 2012]

Originally Posted by Flygirl

I feel like 40k miles is just a bit over getting it broken in, at least these days.

The car has 40K KM not miles.

[groho]

Thats still nearly 25K miles, thats allot of miles in a year. Personally, it sounds like you have several loose wiring connections. Honestly, I would go through your car and make sure connectors are seated tight together; unplug and plug back together. You shouldn't be having this many electrical snaffu's.... The dealer is only going to remove and replace stuff. You'd be amazed how ofter a simple loose or dirty connection can cause a problem. Track you codes and items, and check the connector if it acts up before your drag it to the dealer. These new systems operate on milli volts and 1/10 of an ohm, and the smallest deviation can cause problems.

[Flygirl]

Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket 2012

The car has 40K KM not miles.

Well, that's even worse, then, isn't it? 25k isn't that many miles in a year. Surely you're not suggesting that these cars are really that tender?

In any case...

I experienced something similar in my '89 Mustang GT. Never was diagnosed and repaired; couldn't be duplicated by the dealer. Sucked, seemed to happen at the worst/most embarrassing times.

Replacing things at random is kind of a last resort, isn't it? I mean, that's how *I* repair cars.
:-)