Any Ideas About This Vibration? - Dodge Challenger Forum: Challenger & SRT8 Forums
 
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#1 (permalink) Old 04-26-2013, 10:42 AM
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Any Ideas About This Vibration?

2012 R/T-C 6-speed. I have a vibration felt in the seat not steering wheel at 50-60 mph, mostly felt 53-57 mph. It is NOT wheel/tire related, I've swapped sets and still the same. It is also not RPM related, does it in different gears and while coasting in neutral. Pretty much did it intermittently from new but now a bit harsher and always at that speed. Any ideas before I go to the dealer and listen to them tell me it's the wheel balance?

Also, this feels just like the vibration I had with my 2010 R/T with 18" wheels, if anyone has dealt with that. There was a TSB for that and the fix was to remove the Tinnerman nuts off the studs which I did and it cured it but that TSB was for 18" wheels only. Thanks.

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#2 (permalink) Old 04-26-2013, 11:01 AM
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I picked up a vibration about a year ago, was very slight at 40mph but was very noticeable at 60mph, swapped out wheels and tires with a friend for a couple days and had the same issue. I got under there to check the driveline and have my driveshaft tested and found a chunk of dried road tar on the driveshaft about the size of a quarter. I cleaned that off, and took it for a drive. No more vibration. Good luck with yours.

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#3 (permalink) Old 04-26-2013, 11:50 AM
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Like doc's ^^ post, I'd suspect driveline imbalance since you feel it through the body.

Most wheel/tire imbalance will be felt in the steering wheel or a specific end/corner of the car and comes/goes at varying road speeds.

Driveline imbalance will tend to consistent as its turning more rpm than the wheels will be.

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#4 (permalink) Old 04-26-2013, 01:24 PM
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I agree that the problem may be coming from the driveshaft, possibly the U-joint. Vibrations from the back end of a car will transmit more through the frame of the car and into the seat. This is not always 100% indicative, as there are a number of variables involved in car vibrations.

It's curious, however, that you say the vibration is only noticeable at 50-60 mph. This would indicate a bent wheel or a tire out of round. A vibration that has a “sweet spot” at a certain speed range is a classic symptom of harmonic modulation caused by a small bend. A wheel and tire assembly that is out of round will have a specific harmonic frequency as it spins, depending on how many bends, the severity of the bends, tire wear and other factors. As the speed changes, the harmonic changes, or modulates, as well. At certain speed ranges this modulation can reach a frequency that will overwhelm the vibration-dampening capacities of the suspension. That's the point at which you begin to feel a vibration in the car that was previously being damped out.

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#5 (permalink) Old 04-26-2013, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Cuda340 View Post
I agree that the problem may be coming from the driveshaft, possibly the U-joint. Vibrations from the back end of a car will transmit more through the frame of the car and into the seat. This is not always 100% indicative, as there are a number of variables involved in car vibrations.

It's curious, however, that you say the vibration is only noticeable at 50-60 mph. This would indicate a bent wheel or a tire out of round. A vibration that has a “sweet spot” at a certain speed range is a classic symptom of harmonic modulation caused by a small bend. A wheel and tire assembly that is out of round will have a specific harmonic frequency as it spins, depending on how many bends, the severity of the bends, tire wear and other factors. As the speed changes, the harmonic changes, or modulates, as well. At certain speed ranges this modulation can reach a frequency that will overwhelm the vibration-dampening capacities of the suspension. That's the point at which you begin to feel a vibration in the car that was previously being damped out.

The car came with the Envy wheels. Had them on for about 8k miles and then put on the chrome clad with Nittos for 5k miles, then just swapped back the Envy's to double check that it's not the wheels. Also, the vibration usually cycles every second or so.
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#6 (permalink) Old 04-26-2013, 04:44 PM
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If you or a dealer can support up the rear end and drive the trans to vibration speed this will prove it's drive shaft imbalance. Like others have said - need to inspect for road tar or something attached. In some cases it can be a missing balance weight on drive shaft. If all else fails maybe one of the universal joints are going bad or were not factory lubed and some of the needle bearings are shot.

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#7 (permalink) Old 04-27-2013, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Robo View Post
If you or a dealer can support up the rear end and drive the trans to vibration speed this will prove it's drive shaft imbalance. Like others have said - need to inspect for road tar or something attached. In some cases it can be a missing balance weight on drive shaft. If all else fails maybe one of the universal joints are going bad or were not factory lubed and some of the needle bearings are shot.
No universal joints on these cars - they use flex discs (reinforced rubber couplers) and they're fairly strong. MB has used these since the late 50s and continues on their bi-turbo V12 AMG models as well:

Its the part that has the pink and green color bolts
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#8 (permalink) Old 04-27-2013, 09:13 AM
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No universal joints on these cars - they use flex discs (reinforced rubber couplers) and they're fairly strong. MB has used these since the late 50s and continues on their bi-turbo V12 AMG models as well:

Its the part that has the pink and green color bolts
Learn something new everyday. Haven't been under the car to inspect - I don't miss the old GM universal joints and having to heat them up for removing the injected plastic...lol. I wonder if the OPs drive-line is miss aligned due to these rubber connectors and or not perfectly straight on the car causing this speed dependent frame vibration?

Found this info on benz forum - wonder if we have this as well...

While inspecting my drive shaft flex discs, I found my vibration damper very ragged. I want to replace it, though the price is around $160 vs. $50-$60 for the flex plates.

I have found writings saying the damper is no longer required, pull it out and don't replace it, but I am quite wary of that.

Any one know definitively MB information on the drive shaft vibration damper?

========================================================
Part number 20 is the part I am talking about, "202 410 05 47 driveshaft vibration absorber", and looked pretty thick to me when I had the car in the air. I have had it apart before, but I don't remember the details.

On the diagram, the area where I drew the arrow, that is the washer thickness of you are referring to? That's the attachment flange for the damper?

I would like to save the bucks, I think I will just remove it and re-install.


Last edited by Robo; 04-27-2013 at 09:20 AM.
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#9 (permalink) Old 04-27-2013, 10:58 AM
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No universal joints on these cars - they use flex discs (reinforced rubber couplers) and they're fairly strong. MB has used these since the late 50s and continues on their bi-turbo V12 AMG models as well:
Its the part that has the pink and green color bolts

Yep, I crawled under this morning and noticed that. Weird looking drive shaft. Not the kind of stuff I'm used to, but then again, I haven't messed with this kind of thing for many years. Thanks.
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#10 (permalink) Old 04-27-2013, 02:57 PM
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There's also a center carrier bearing (mid point along prop shaft) - that's another thing to investigate to eliminate.

I'm not aware of any vibration dampers on ours -that image for the (presumably W124 chassis) is for an older model that went out of production in '95.

The only damper I'm aware of is on the Getrag 226mm to quell any potential whining - this appeared on the later '11 production cars and was a retro-fit for any early models with customer complaints about diff. noise.
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