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Replacing Ball Joints at 70K?

12K views 17 replies 10 participants last post by  hellkitty 
#1 ·
Need some advice...

I have a 09 Chally, 70K on it and I started to hear a whistling coming from under the car after driving 30-40 minutes about a week ago.

It has since gotten louder, although at times it completely goes away or I don't hear it at all.

So I took it into a shop and they told me it was the ball joints... and that it would cost a little over $1,200 to fix. They said it's safe for the time being to drive and that they would only allow me to pay the 1,200 at once instead of say getting the lowers done for $600 at once and a week or so later getting the uppers done.

Does that sound right? I didn't take it to a dealer, I took it to a local shop.

I'm certainly going to take it to a more trusted mechanic next week, he was just on vacation currently. I know it's a known problem for Challengers and Chargers to have bad ball joints but I didn't know it was going to cost that much.

If anyone has any suggestions or advice it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
 
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#3 · (Edited)
Will do.

I just got my car back today from that shop which was a chain mechanic shop (Mr. Tire, formally known as Vespia), they gave a total bill of $1,397 for only LOWER ball joints, telling me that the uppers were in completely fine shape.

Obviously I wasn't about to pay it and even one of their employees suggested for me not to so... WTF?

...1,400 FOR LOWER BALL JOINTS?! They also said some spiel about how I could do a 6 month pay off plan with Goodyear. No thanks.

I only took my car there because they were the only place open on the 4th and I'm basically stuck working 55 hours a week which doesn't leave me much time to not have a car to get to work with. Gonna have to bite the bullet and get a rental when I actually can take it to an honest mechanic.

Sorry, just had to rant about that.
 
#5 ·
Read this excellent explanation about ball joint wear, especially the diagnosis, before you make any hasty (and expensive) decision:

Driving

The first indication of wearing ball joints can be very subtle, and develop slowly enough that you may not notice. Ball joints, because they wear in all directions and are tied into so many other parts, will tend to make a vehicle feel vague and wandering where it was once sharp and precise. This is particularly noticeable in the steering, where even a small amount of wear can allow your steering wheel to wander a bit just off-center before it turns the wheels, and wander a bit more as you turn them back. But this initial vagueness is easy to miss or ignore. Less so are later driving symptoms. When ball joints start wearing out more, the vehicle may start pulling to one side, and may feel darty, loose, and spookily slow to respond to corrections when it does decide to veer off course. Alternately, depending on how the joint is worn, and which joints are worn, the steering itself could become very tight and "notchy" when it moves, while the vehicle responds in a nervous and spastic manner to inputs.

Noise

Loud banging or popping noises are a primary indicator of bad ball joints, but the type and degree of the noise will vary from joint to joint. Steering ball joints don't often make much noise, aside from perhaps a slight tap when you turn the wheel. It's quiet enough, though, that you're as likely to feel it through the steering wheel as hear it. Upper and lower suspension ball joints aren't nearly as restrained; a really bad one can be about as subtle as a sledgehammer to your fender. They'll start out making quieter thuds and clunks when you hit a pothole or speedbump, eventually progressing to a single, loud bang over smaller imperfections, and as you enter into a left or right turn. Once you start hearing that, address the ball joint immediately before your suspension hammers itself to pieces.

Tire Wear


Ball joints will wear out fairly slowly, at least in the initial phases. Even before you start hearing noises or notice changes in the way your car drives, you may see evidence of failure in your tires. As ball joints fail, they'll typically allow the front of the wheels to point outward, away from each other in a condition called "toe-out." This toe-out is actually what makes a vehicle with worn ball joints feel twitchy and unstable, because the tires are always trying to turn away from the car. It also causes a particular kind of tire wear. Toe wear starts as uneven wear on one side of the tire tread, and feathers gently across the tread toward the middle. This is a subtler variation of "camber wear," which is also common on tire with ball joint issues. Camber wear happens when the tire leans either in or out at the top, causing a hard line of excess wear along one edge of the tire. Either or both of these can indicate ball joint problems.

Diagnosis -- Rocking the Tire


Lift the vehicle off the ground so the wheels are hanging. Grasp one tire at the top and bottom, and try to pull and push the top and bottom in and out. If the tire rocks by any noticeable degree, and especially if the movement is accompanied by a clinking or clunking sound, you likely have a bad ball joint or two. This test can also indicate a bad wheel bearing, but that will also grumble and vibrate as you drive in a straight line. Next, try rocking the tire side to side, as though you were attempting to turn it. A certain amount of play is fairly normal, but listen for clicking noises, and watch the other tire and the ball joint on the steering end-link. If the tire is just moving the end-link back and forth without moving the linkage or the other tire, it's likely worn out.

Wear Indicators


Some lower ball joints also often have wear indicators on the bottom. The ball of the joint presses on the cup-shaped socket in the bottom. As the ball and socket wear, the socket sinks up into the joint, and the case slides down over it. The exposed, protruding part of a new ball joint is called -- appropriately -- the "shoulder." If your vehicle has those type of ball joints, lay a straight edge on the bottom of the ball joint. It should come to rest on the shoulder protruding from the bottom of the joint, not the edges of the joint case. If the bottom of the joint is completely flat, or the shoulder is recessed into the case, it's worn out. A set of feeler gauges can be handy here, since the clearances involved are so small that they may not be visible to the naked eye.
 
#18 ·
Read this excellent explanation about ball joint wear, especially the diagnosis, before you make any hasty (and expensive) decision:

Driving

The first indication of wearing ball joints can be very subtle, and develop slowly enough that you may not notice. Ball joints, because they wear in all directions and are tied into so many other parts, will tend to make a vehicle feel vague and wandering where it was once sharp and precise. This is particularly noticeable in the steering, where even a small amount of wear can allow your steering wheel to wander a bit just off-center before it turns the wheels, and wander a bit more as you turn them back. But this initial vagueness is easy to miss or ignore. Less so are later driving symptoms. When ball joints start wearing out more, the vehicle may start pulling to one side, and may feel darty, loose, and spookily slow to respond to corrections when it does decide to veer off course. Alternately, depending on how the joint is worn, and which joints are worn, the steering itself could become very tight and "notchy" when it moves, while the vehicle responds in a nervous and spastic manner to inputs.

Noise

Loud banging or popping noises are a primary indicator of bad ball joints, but the type and degree of the noise will vary from joint to joint. Steering ball joints don't often make much noise, aside from perhaps a slight tap when you turn the wheel. It's quiet enough, though, that you're as likely to feel it through the steering wheel as hear it. Upper and lower suspension ball joints aren't nearly as restrained; a really bad one can be about as subtle as a sledgehammer to your fender. They'll start out making quieter thuds and clunks when you hit a pothole or speedbump, eventually progressing to a single, loud bang over smaller imperfections, and as you enter into a left or right turn. Once you start hearing that, address the ball joint immediately before your suspension hammers itself to pieces.

Tire Wear

Ball joints will wear out fairly slowly, at least in the initial phases. Even before you start hearing noises or notice changes in the way your car drives, you may see evidence of failure in your tires. As ball joints fail, they'll typically allow the front of the wheels to point outward, away from each other in a condition called "toe-out." This toe-out is actually what makes a vehicle with worn ball joints feel twitchy and unstable, because the tires are always trying to turn away from the car. It also causes a particular kind of tire wear. Toe wear starts as uneven wear on one side of the tire tread, and feathers gently across the tread toward the middle. This is a subtler variation of "camber wear," which is also common on tire with ball joint issues. Camber wear happens when the tire leans either in or out at the top, causing a hard line of excess wear along one edge of the tire. Either or both of these can indicate ball joint problems.

Diagnosis -- Rocking the Tire

Lift the vehicle off the ground so the wheels are hanging. Grasp one tire at the top and bottom, and try to pull and push the top and bottom in and out. If the tire rocks by any noticeable degree, and especially if the movement is accompanied by a clinking or clunking sound, you likely have a bad ball joint or two. This test can also indicate a bad wheel bearing, but that will also grumble and vibrate as you drive in a straight line. Next, try rocking the tire side to side, as though you were attempting to turn it. A certain amount of play is fairly normal, but listen for clicking noises, and watch the other tire and the ball joint on the steering end-link. If the tire is just moving the end-link back and forth without moving the linkage or the other tire, it's likely worn out.

Wear Indicators

Some lower ball joints also often have wear indicators on the bottom. The ball of the joint presses on the cup-shaped socket in the bottom. As the ball and socket wear, the socket sinks up into the joint, and the case slides down over it. The exposed, protruding part of a new ball joint is called -- appropriately -- the "shoulder." If your vehicle has those type of ball joints, lay a straight edge on the bottom of the ball joint. It should come to rest on the shoulder protruding from the bottom of the joint, not the edges of the joint case. If the bottom of the joint is completely flat, or the shoulder is recessed into the case, it's worn out. A set of feeler gauges can be handy here, since the clearances involved are so small that they may not be visible to the naked eye.
This is extremely helpful! Thank you for posting!
 
#7 ·
Just to show how off they are, when you really need ball joints for $250 you can get most everything up there beyond ball joints to include "Moog K7469 adjustable freaking ball joints":banger: Fleabay listing : 2 Front Left/Right Lower Rear Control Arms: 2-CA81085 and 2 Front Left/Right Lower Control Arms: 1-CB81083(Left) 1-CB81084 (Right) 2 Inner Tie Rod Ends: 2-EV80702 2 Outer Tie Rod Ends: 2-ES3571 2 Front Left/Right Sway Bar Links: 1-K80823(Left) 1-K80822 (Right) 2 Front Left/Right Upper Control Arms: 1-CB81087(Left) 1-CB81088 (Right) 2 Front Left/Right Lower Ball Joints: (Adjustable Ball Joints) 2-K7469. You can find some one competent to install for a lot less than those f**k's 1400 - $250 = $1150
 
#14 ·
You are the man... THANK YOU for all the part numbers incase that is the problem (I was reading that the Moogs are WAY better than Dodge OEMs

Doesn't sound like ball joints to me. Ball joints don't "whistle".....sounds more like a rotating part "whining".

Used to own a Chrysler 300 (read up on THOSE things, re: ball joints) and passenger side lower SNAPPED on me without warning.

Funny enough I was going low speed or else I'd probably be dead. Passenger fron t dropped was down, wheel canted in like crazy.

Any chance you can get a recording of the noise?
I could and I will if the shop that it's currently at doesn't find the problem...The sound is like one of the cicada bugs, but then it gets really loud, the longer or faster that I drive. I barely ever hear it doing 30 mph or less.

I dropped it off today at a much more trusted mechanic that my family has known for quite some time, so I'm hoping he can find the problem easily enough.

About your Chrysler, that sounds insanely freaky... Weird that it would snap at lower speeds.. Whatever the case, thank God that it did.

Could be a vacuum leak or a leak in the intake manifold.
Ahhh, yes. Originally after googling, this is what I thought it was.

Hi From what your describing ( sound goes away when you step on the brakes ) I would say that the whistling sound comes from the wear indicator on one of your brake pads. Have the brakes been looked at lately? sometimes the wear indicator is bent in and the pads are ok.
I put brand new rotors (the vented kind) in with new brake pads a few months ago. So I didn't think this was the problem, however I drive 100 miles a day (50 miles to work) and am sometimes rough on the brakes, so I'm not ruling it out.

Thanks for the feedback everybody.
 
#8 ·
Doesn't sound like ball joints to me. Ball joints don't "whistle".....sounds more like a rotating part "whining".

Used to own a Chrysler 300 (read up on THOSE things, re: ball joints) and passenger side lower SNAPPED on me without warning.

Funny enough I was going low speed or else I'd probably be dead. Passenger fron t dropped was down, wheel canted in like crazy.

Any chance you can get a recording of the noise?
 
#10 ·
Hi From what your describing ( sound goes away when you step on the brakes ) I would say that the whistling sound comes from the wear indicator on one of your brake pads. Have the brakes been looked at lately? sometimes the wear indicator is bent in and the pads are ok.
 
#12 ·
I've never done ball joints on a Dodge, but $1200-1400 sounds very high to me. I could see half of that.

But ball joints shouldn't be the problem anyway.
 
#13 · (Edited)
OP.............Your shop quote was done by someone smoking CRACK! I replaced mine myself for less than $200.00 INCLUDING an alignment afterwards!

Seriously people, do just minimal research on the subject and you will be somewhat informed on what may be going on with your vehicle.

Whistling ball joints? WOW!
 
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#17 ·
I am actually getting probably the exact same issue - high pitch squeaky sound at highway speed - usually. If I touch the breaks it stops, comes back when I get on the gas. Sometimes it shows up at slow speed - parking lots - and it does sound like it is linked to the tire rotating... Will try to get to a dealership to look at it.
 
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