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  #191 (permalink)  
Old 05-01-2012, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts View Post
there is a huge fleet of police Chargers with MDS, if there was an issue they would know, not a single reported issue and believe me those large fleets bitch at everything, and i mean everything

it is an non issue, because a few people have suffered failures doesn't mean its an epidemic, it isn't, 100's of people die every year of the common cold, that doesn't make it an epidemic either

Luke

ps, i know your going to bash me for it, but the numbers dint lie, the failure rate is probably below .001%, im sorry some people have had a failure, warranty is calculated with a certain expected number of failures and failures dollars, all manufacturers expect a certain number of failures and the hemi engines are signifcantly below that level they expected
before you pass judgment on the percentage of failure being so low, remember theses car 2009,2010,2011,2012 car are still very new. Most of these engine failures are happening after 30,xxx plus miles. Most of these cars don't even have close the milage as the ones reporting engine failure.

Also, on the police car issue, has anyone actually torn down one of those engines to see if they use the same chain setup as a regular r/t has? (general public)?

And also Luke, just curious as why you are standing behind Dodge so much on these issues? Getting paid to say these things? And where are you getting your facts from? According to my dealer my engines (2) replaced so far are showing they just replace the heads on one and the other shows reprogrammed the computer. So if they aren't reporting the real work that is been done no one will ever know the real failure numbers.

Bub
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  #192 (permalink)  
Old 05-01-2012, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Hemi09Challenger R/T View Post
before you pass judgment on the percentage of failure being so low, remember theses car 2009,2010,2011,2012 car are still very new. Most of these engine failures are happening after 30,xxx plus miles. Most of these cars don't even have close the milage as the ones reporting engine failure.

Also, on the police car issue, has anyone actually torn down one of those engines to see if they use the same chain setup as a regular r/t has? (general public)?

And also Luke, just curious as why you are standing behind Dodge so much on these issues? Getting paid to say these things? And where are you getting your facts from? According to my dealer my engines (2) replaced so far are showing they just replace the heads on one and the other shows reprogrammed the computer. So if they aren't reporting the real work that is been done no one will ever know the real failure numbers.

Bub

i'll be the first to tell you what is right and what is wrong, my dm gets an ear full all the time, i contantly pick on him for what Chrysler does wrong....perfect example in a mtg last week in front of a room of nearly 100 managers, they tried to tell us the back order issues was significantly better at 96% fill rate, i immediatelly cried foul, back order issues are the worst we have ever seen......

timing chain failures, seem no one has heard of any except on 09 thru 10 Challenger with MDS at 30k and on this forum......national demand is nearly non existent, conversations with reps and field service engineers shake their heads, the fleets we speak to on a daily basis say the same thing, one of the largest state trooper garage in NC, has never seen one....and we have replaced all 4 hemi engines they have replaced, 3 in the same car.....im sorry i dont see it.....

in fact im so worried about timing chain failures, i just bought a second Challenger, auto with mds for my lovely wife

i think some people blow things way out of proportion, ok so a few cars have experience a chain failure......the majority of 2009 and 2010 police Chargers have well in excess of 50k, due to budget restraint they are now keeping cars until 150k miles

cooling fans have been the major issue on cop cars......

on the other side of the coin, i think there is a real issue with unusual dents......have seen some complaints and experience a couple,

outside sheet metal of our beloved Challengers amount to not much more than a pepsi can

something i find very dissapointing with the cars

Luke
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  #193 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2012, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts View Post
timing chain failures, seem no one has heard of any except on 09 thru 10 Challenger with MDS at 30k and on this forum......national demand is nearly non existent, conversations with reps and field service engineers shake their heads, the fleets we speak to on a daily basis say the same thing, one of the largest state trooper garage in NC, has never seen one....and we have replaced all 4 hemi engines they have replaced, 3 in the same car.....im sorry i dont see it.....
Yet, this thread alone is producing two timing chain breaks per month, an item I might add is almost never known to fail -- yet they are failing.

If you don't think there is a problem, fine, then why not just leave this thread alone rather than keep coming back and skewing it in all different directions in defiance of what is actually happening. We are talking about timing chain failures on the Dodge Challenger -- not the Charger, not the 300, not the Ram -- the Challenger. It seems to be affecting the 5.7L Dodge Challenger exclusively, so we don't need to hear about some pre-2009 police Charger fleet that is carrying the heavier timing chain anyway. Not the same car, not the same engine, not on point.

So what do you say that we keep it directed at the 5.7L Dodge Challenger. Much appreciated.
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  #194 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2012, 05:36 PM
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The problem as described is specific and revolves around the vibration as result of the MDS. If you look at this thread folks were using their cars conservatively while commuting. I doubt any of the cop cars see any MDS time. As I stated earlier I have a friend that had this happen on his car which is used for commuting so in our small community if I know someone with this issue I'm sure there are many more that are not into forums etc that have the issue we don't here bout. We can't say there isn't a problem, what we have is a problem resulting from a specific set of parameters. It's NOT OK to say this is just normal failure. If it were normal failure it statistically would be multiple occurrences with varying and random circumstances that contributed to the failure. Here we have a failure with common circumstances that contributed to the failure which is referred to as “assignable cause”. It is also NOT OK for these to fail and maybe the poor owner will be fortunate enough that his vehicle will still be under warranty. If an owner is unfortunate enough for this to happen after his warranty expired and has to foot the bill for major engine damage his or her self when it is a known, documented failure is totally unacceptable.
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  #195 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2012, 05:54 PM
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I have a 2010 RT auto with 29,700 no problems at all .... is there a better TC to upgrade to instead of waiting for mine to fail and cause damage?
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  #196 (permalink)  
Old 05-03-2012, 06:17 AM
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There should be no timing chain failures on any modern car.

To those that say all the failures are normal per production numbers on this car are a bunch of idiots. There is something not right here. Timing chains don't break like this on such low milage.

Chrysler should just do the recall and move on. Too Expensive? Too bad. Don't make crappy engine components. What do you expect when you make a timing chain that breaks around 30,000 miles?
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  #197 (permalink)  
Old 05-05-2012, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by quickrt View Post
The problem as described is specific and revolves around the vibration as result of the MDS. If you look at this thread folks were using their cars conservatively while commuting. I doubt any of the cop cars see any MDS time. As I stated earlier I have a friend that had this happen on his car which is used for commuting so in our small community if I know someone with this issue I'm sure there are many more that are not into forums etc that have the issue we don't here bout. We can't say there isn't a problem, what we have is a problem resulting from a specific set of parameters. It's NOT OK to say this is just normal failure. If it were normal failure it statistically would be multiple occurrences with varying and random circumstances that contributed to the failure. Here we have a failure with common circumstances that contributed to the failure which is referred to as ā€œassignable causeā€. It is also NOT OK for these to fail and maybe the poor owner will be fortunate enough that his vehicle will still be under warranty. If an owner is unfortunate enough for this to happen after his warranty expired and has to foot the bill for major engine damage his or her self when it is a known, documented failure is totally unacceptable.
Do cop cars even have MDS?
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  #198 (permalink)  
Old 05-05-2012, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by pdx.challenger View Post
I'm curious, is this also happening on 300's & Chargers???

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  #199 (permalink)  
Old 05-18-2012, 06:06 PM
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Red face Timing chain failures

Police cars have heavy duty everything. They wouldn't think of putting that bike chain in a cop car. Everytime I need a part for my Dodge Ram they need the VIN # which spells everything out. The bean counters found a way for Chrysler to save $1.00 on timing chains and maybe tensioners and we pay the price.

Glad I have a 2010 Srt w/ 6.1 Engine.
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  #200 (permalink)  
Old 05-19-2012, 03:35 AM
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Originally Posted by tonysrt View Post
Police cars have heavy duty everything. They wouldn't think of putting that bike chain in a cop car. Everytime I need a part for my Dodge Ram they need the VIN # which spells everything out. The bean counters found a way for Chrysler to save $1.00 on timing chains and maybe tensioners and we pay the price.

Glad I have a 2010 Srt w/ 6.1 Engine.

Engines in the police cars are the same. Heavy duty means radiator, coolant hoses, P/S cooler and trans cooler, not internal engine components. If Dodge uses the same chain in a 5.7 that is in the 392 then surely you can't think a 5.7 in a Charger cop car is going to have anything different.
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