Timing chain failure on the Dodge Challenger - Page 36 - Dodge Challenger Forum: Challenger & SRT8 Forums
 
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#351 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holeshot View Post
I wonder why the 2012 6-speed is rated 5 HP higher than the automatic?? Also, it looks like the PCV system has been redesigned, compared to the earlier years that I saw here in the catch can installation threads. I bought an air compressor water separator for it but not installing until I find out if 2012s have been cured.
All years of the 5.7 / 6-speed were rated higher from '09 onward.

Different exhaust system (although '11+ cars exhausts appear to be more similar auto vs. 'stick) which is louder and had less back-pressure and incorporates an H-pipe cross-over vs. the 'auto version. There's also more aggressive spark timing on the 6-speed cars, which necessitates 91 octane to get peak performance as well.

The automatics had different exhaust (and rear resonators) to compensate for the effect on sound MDS creates when in operation. In the earlier years '09-'10, the 'autos had the suitcase muffler, which changed to the current setup used since the '11s came out.

Interestingly enough, the SRT models also used a different exhaust, but the hp/tq ratings were the same whether it was the 6.1 or 6.4 with either tranny.

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#352 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 11:06 AM
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Just happened last Saturday...

1. 38,500 miles
2. going 80 mph on freeway
3. 2010 r/t auto

At the dealer right now taking it apart to check what happened. got the lifetime warranty. They haven't told me yet what it is, should I suggest to them that it may be the timing chain, or should I let them tell me what they "found"?

Last edited by rt2010mm; 06-26-2012 at 11:06 AM. Reason: added year of car
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#353 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by raVenX View Post
Personally, I have ruled out oil. If you look through the list of people affected thus far, you'll note that many of them stated that they changed oil as required. Even Desert Bum stated that he changed oil, the correct oil, religiously, and it still happened. Using the wrong type of oil will cause the MDS feature not to function, and it functioning is a common factor.

The common factors right now are:

1. Challenger 5.7L, automatic trans. and MDS

2. Highway speeds

3. MDS engaged

4. Roughly 40,000 miles on the odometer
I'm not talking about oil changes or even quality of the oil. What I was implying is that it could be something as simple as certain parts/systems on the engine (namely the chain and/or tensioner) just may not be liking the 5w20 oil...or maybe that oil grade is right on the threshold where those parts are happy (it could go either way...no troubles whatsoever or just enough to bring it down). Maybe if you are trying out 0w20, it's like a double whammy of odds working against (like eating a steak isn't going to kill you outright, but it certainly worsens your chances...doesn't stop me from indulging, though )?

I understand the mds needs a certain oil weight to be operational. That just makes it harder to distinguish if it is the hardware or the oil the hardware needs that is the actual culprit. Do the 6-spd manuals use the same 5w-20 or something thicker? If all manual drivers suddenly switched to it, would they start dropping like flies, too (relatively speaking in the context of auto RT's that are breaking down)? It's a question that could never be answered just by the logistics of it all, but it doesn't mean it is irrelevant.

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Last edited by randycat99; 06-26-2012 at 12:22 PM.
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#354 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 12:56 PM
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I dis-abled the MDS on my 2010 with a predator, sounds better. Should everyone just do a timing chain change at 30,000 miles as preventative maintenance? Is there an aftermarket timing change that would eliminate this issue? Seems like Dodge would eventually do a TSB on a recommended timing change interval when they have conclusive evidence that the current timing change is a weak link. What are owenrs thoughts on this impending issue? I have an auto and a 6 speed, is it a factor on the 6 speedds also?

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#355 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt2010mm View Post
Just happened last Saturday...

1. 38,500 miles
2. going 80 mph on freeway
3. 2010 r/t auto

At the dealer right now taking it apart to check what happened. got the lifetime warranty. They haven't told me yet what it is, should I suggest to them that it may be the timing chain, or should I let them tell me what they "found"?
If it's not too late, try to get some close-up pics of the broken parts, there are a few people on the forum here that would really like to see how the parts are breaking on other cars than their own. Thanks

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#356 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt2010mm View Post
Just happened last Saturday...

1. 38,500 miles
2. going 80 mph on freeway
3. 2010 r/t auto

At the dealer right now taking it apart to check what happened. got the lifetime warranty. They haven't told me yet what it is, should I suggest to them that it may be the timing chain, or should I let them tell me what they "found"?
I can't imagine it would make any difference one way or the other if you told them or not.

Thanks for checking in with your report.

Keep us informed of the progress, your dealer experience, what they tell you, what they replace, etc.

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#357 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 01:24 PM
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Has anyone examined the timing chain on a high mileage, highway driven, 5.7 challenger with mds that hasn't yet failed? May need to magnaflux it.

I'm curious to know if there are signs of stress cracks or metal fatigue on the chain or the start of any cracks in the tensioner.
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#358 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 03:00 PM
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That's an interesting detail!
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#359 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LETSJET View Post
I dis-abled the MDS on my 2010 with a predator, sounds better. Should everyone just do a timing chain change at 30,000 miles as preventative maintenance? Is there an aftermarket timing change that would eliminate this issue? Seems like Dodge would eventually do a TSB on a recommended timing change interval when they have conclusive evidence that the current timing change is a weak link. What are owenrs thoughts on this impending issue? I have an auto and a 6 speed, is it a factor on the 6 speedds also?
That sounds like a good pro-active strategy, even if it is just replacing with a new chain that is the same model. The cherry on top is if there was a designated "specialist" amongst our community who everybody could send their intact old chain to (with appropriate documentation to record the details of its history). If there are consistent wear patterns (or micro-crack fatigues as was described in an earlier post) that are unique to installations on the auto Challengers (as opposed to a typical, high mileage chain from a Hemi in the stick or any other Hemi Dodge models, altogether), that would be an important piece of the puzzle.

An additional perk (not that anyone should hope for this scenario) is if they replace the chain, and something still breaks in that area (like the tensioner), that would be important to know, as well.

There's probably enough info before us right now for Dodge to officially specify some highly-recommended pro-active measures...like a tensioner mechanism inspection at 30k? If high wear is noted, a new one should be installed. I'm guessing that still requires tearing off a bunch of stuff to get to, from being just a casual preventative inspection procedure? Anybody know more about such a process?...degree of labor and cost?

Last edited by randycat99; 06-26-2012 at 03:20 PM.
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#360 (permalink) Old 06-26-2012, 03:16 PM
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It would be pretty sad you have to do a timing chain/tensioner inspection or change before you even do your spark plugs.

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  Dodge Challenger Forum: Challenger & SRT8 Forums > General, Performance, and Technical > General Challenger Discussion > Challenger Issues & Problems

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