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Timing chain failure on the Dodge Challenger

1M views 6K replies 443 participants last post by  Mopar Frank 
#1 · (Edited)
I have been finding many reports of the timing chain breaking on the Dodge Challenger, mostly in the 5.7L Hemi engines. The timing chain breaks in most reported instances around the 35K-40K mile range.

Once the timing chain breaks, the end result is usually the valves smacking the pistons which bend the valves, damages the pistons and leads to catastrophic engine failure. This often requires a new long block.

How many of you have had the timing chain break? How many miles on the car when when it happened? and what was your experience in getting it repaired?

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Known instances of the timing chain breaking on the 5.7L Dodge Challenger just in this forum alone in the past few months:

1. 06/27/2011 -- mileage not mentioned -- ... come to find out the timing chain broke ...

2. 07/19/2011 -- 85,000 miles -- ... and the timing chain broke...

3. 09/27/2011 -- 33,385 miles -- 2009 R/T Motor Broke

4. 11/23/2011 -- 38,000 miles -- Club member's car. Broken timing chain. Car in shop for over two months.

5. 12/07/2011 -- 34,000 miles -- I found this thread the hard way...

6. 12/19/2011 -- 22,600 miles -- 2010 Challenger - Timing Chain Breaks...

7. 01/21/2012 -- 60,000 miles -- Engine went..........

8. 02/02/2012 -- 38,000 miles -- 2009 Challenger R/T lost a second motor .. (Second occurrence. See #3 above. 4,000 miles on new motor).

9. 03/08/2012 -- 50,000 miles -- BLOWN ENGINE 50,000 miles

10. 03/23/2012 -- 14,000 miles -- ... my timing chain snapped

11. 04/04/2012 -- 53,500 miles -- My timing chain just broke today ...

12. 04/16/2012 -- 46,000 miles -- Mine is in the shop with a broken timing chain...

13. 04/27/2012 -- 31,000 miles -- My chain broke back in December of 2011 ...

14. 05/22/2012 -- 37,000 miles -- Here's another 2010 Auto R/T with a broken timing chain! ...

15. 06/13/2012 -- 40,257 miles -- I too have a broken timing chain ...

16. 06/23/2012 -- 38,485 miles -- Guess I can be added to the list ...

17. 06/26/2012 -- 38,500 miles -- Just happened last Saturday ...

18. 08/02/2012 -- 59,134 miles -- ... all of a sudden Bam the engine shuts down

19. 08/03/2012 -- 38,000 miles -- I had this happen at 38000 miles, 2010 R/T Auto

20. 08/08/2012 -- 27,000 miles -- The timing chain on my 2010 R/T just broke ...

21. 08/10/2012 -- 59,300 miles -- ... timing chain broke again. (Third occurrence. See #3 and #8 above. 16,000 miles on new motor).

22. 08/10/2012 -- 63,000 miles -- ... timing chain broke cruising at 70mph on the highway

23. 09/03/2012 -- 40,000 miles -- ... while driving to dallas my timing chain broke

24. 09/11/2012 -- 24,000 miles -- Welp - chalk up another one ... (first 2011 to be reported here)

25. 09/21/2012 -- 31,100 miles -- This just happened a few days ago ...

26. 10/10/2012 -- 42,559 miles -- Well it's looking like I'm the latest timing chain victim ...

27. 10/24/2012 -- 65,000 miles -- ... driving on the highway 65MPH and "Pop goes to weasel"

28. 11/18/2012 -- 40,000 miles -- Mine just broke...2010 mopar 10, no mods, auto ... (first to break not at highway speeds)

29. 11/19/2012 -- 39,000 miles -- just got another 2010 with 39000 in today ...

30. 12/04/2012 -- 40,000 miles -- The timing chain on my 2010 Auto RT broke last Friday ...

31. 12/09/2012 -- miles pending -- ... R/T not running at the moment timing chain broke ...

32. 12/11/2012 -- 27,000 miles -- ... cruising on the interstate at 70, MDS on, when suddenly loss of power ...

33. 01/03/2013 -- 58,000 miles -- ... the dealer has confirmed that I did have a timing chain failure.

34. 01/22/2013 -- 40,000 miles -- It has been confirmed I as well did have a broken timing chain

35. 01/22/2013 -- 43,000 miles -- 2010 R/T, 5-speed auto with mds. No mods at all.

36. 02/22/2013 -- 52,000 miles -- ... it happen to me this weekend ...

37. 04/15/2013 -- 55,000 miles -- I have now become victim to a failed timing chain

38. 04/20/2013 -- 73,000 miles -- cruising at 65 mph, in MSD, engine 'shut down'

39. 05/13/2013 -- 66,000 miles -- lost it on the interstate doing 73 in MDS

40. 05/20/2013 -- 56.616 miles -- ... on the freeway headed to work in the rain and Wham

41. 05/24/2013 -- 28,000 miles -- the chain went on the highway at 70+ mph

42. 06/07/2013 -- 88,256 miles -- ... driving down the highway heard a loud pop ...

43. 07/01/2013 -- 52,000 miles -- Timing chain broke on freeway ...

44. 07/23/2013 -- 54,057 miles -- Was in a canyon going uphill at about 55mph ... (claims MDS not engaged)

45. 07/26/2013 -- 49,000 miles -- Cruising along 65 mph engine stalled.

46. 08/10/2013 -- 22,281 miles -- I wish I found this topic sooner

47. 09/17/2013 -- 40,091 miles -- driving 74 mph in cruse control just died ...

48. 10/04/2013 -- 68,000 miles -- Add another one to the list OMG.

49. 10/22/2013 -- 89,000 miles -- Timing chain went on my 09 Challenger

50. 11/13/2013 -- 55,320 miles -- I had hoped I would never be posting this message ...

51. 11/13/2013 -- 42,342 miles -- Just got up to highway speed Bam Powerloss ...

52. 11/21/2013 -- 53,000 miles -- Add me to the list of failures ...

53. 11/27/2013 -- 73,000 miles -- I was cruising at highway speeds (70 mph), in MDS

54. Recall initiated, see below.

Remember, these reports are from this forum alone. Real world numbers are greatly increased.

The things in common when the timing chain breaks so far are:

1. MDS is activated (auto trans., so 6-speed are excluded)
2. Traveling at freeway speeds (or coming off of freeway)
3. 2009-2011 model years affected so far.
4. Limited to the 5.7L motor so far
5. Dodge Challenger only

Things ruled out thus far:

A. 6-speed manual transmissions not affected
B. Other 5.7L vehicles not affected, i.e., Charger, 300, Ram truck
C. New guide shoe (white color) has also failed (see #8 on list of failures)
D. New crate motor has also failed (see #3 and #8 on list of failures)
E. Both stock and mod cars affected
F. Both stock tune and Predator tune (with MDS turned on) affected
G. All oil change intervals affected, i.e., 3,000 miles, 5,000 miles, etc.
H. All types of oil affected, i.e., both synthetic and conventional oil

* Author's notes (last updated 10/28/13):

(1) When I created this thread, I was so taken back by a timing chain failure happening and discovering at least a half dozen similar occurrences, that I attempted to discover if anyone here had experienced a timing chain failure and what their dealership experience was. I got a lot of adverse feedback along the lines of "alarmist" and "chicken little" and other name calling, including some from dealerships and master mechanics, as can be seen in just the first few hundred posts below. Many attempted to derail this thread by taking it off-topic on many, many occasions. Some are still out there promoting denial of the issue. Still, the problem remains, it is real and it continues to plague fellow Challenger owners.

(2) The timing chain concern can be alleviated by disabling MDS (a band-aid solution not a fix). All but one recent report have shown that MDS was engaged and the car was traveling at freeway speeds. You can prevent MDS from being activated by switching into manual mode while driving on the freeway. You can read How to use the Autostick feature and manual mode here. You can also use a tuner to disable the MDS feature, but be forewarned, if the dealership discovers your use of a tuner on the car, you are in for a fight to get the repairs done under warranty.

(3) Chrysler is aware of the issue and has been monitoring this thread for some time regardless of they might tell you. In addition, many people have already telephoned customer service and have written to Chrysler directly. But, even without all of that, you don't have timing chains, tensioners, heads and short blocks rolling out of the warehouse in the numbers that they have without raising some internal red flags of a potential issue.

(4) Talks of running off to court and filing a lawsuit over this issue are misguided. Your warranty specifically states that you MUST first submit the matter to arbitration. Any lawsuit would be immediately dismissed, and now you are out the filing fees.

(5) When I first created this thread, the weekly parts demand for timing chains was at about 15. It is currently hovering around 35 at the moment.

(6) Chrysler has switched from the black tensioner and guide to white (supposedly stronger) and then to an aluminum tensioner and guide with a plastic face plate (the current part). Both black and white guides have failed. No reports of the aluminum failing yet but they are relatively new first showing up in mid-2013 R/T's.

(7) The exact cause of the timing chain failure is still unknown. In fact, it may never been known. There are just too many factors involved to isolate the problem, and if we haven't discovered the cause in over 350,000 page views, how can we expect Chrysler to? While there is a lot of speculation as to the exact cause, which seems to go round-and-round every few hundred posts, it is all just that -- speculation. What we do for for certain is that MDS is playing a part in the timing chain failures.

(8) Special shout outs to Desert Bum, Hal H, hmk123, Force10, 19johned53, and the nameless many who have helped to keep this issue real and on topic. Your comments are appreciated.

---------

* Author's notes (last updated 02/12/14):

Customer Satisfaction Notification P01
Engine Timing Chain and Chain Guide
Models
IMPORTANT: Some of the involved vehicles may be in dealer used vehicle inventory. Dealers should complete this repair on these vehicles before retail delivery. Dealers should also perform this repair on vehicles in for service. Involved vehicles can be determined by using the VIP inquiry process.
Subject
Repair
2009-2012 (LC) Dodge Challenger
(LD) Dodge Charger
(LX) Chrysler 300
NOTE: This recall applies only to the above vehicles equipped with a 5.7L Hemi engine (sales code EZD or EZH), automatic transmission (sales code DGJ) and rear axle ratio 3.06, 3.73 or 3.92 (sales code DMP, DME or DMH) built from August 04, 2008 through July 10, 2012 (MDH 080406 through 071008).
The engine timing chain guide on about 50,800 of the above vehicles may fracture. A fractured engine timing chain guide could cause the engine timing chain to break. A broken engine timing chain will result in severe engine damage.
The engine timing chain, timing chain tensioner and timing chain guide must be replaced.
Customer Satisfaction Notification P01 Engine Timing Chain and Chain Guide Page 2
Part Number Description
CBPRN291AA Engine Timing Chain Package
Each package contains the following components:
Quantity Description
1 Chain, Engine Timing
1 Guide, Engine Timing Chain
1 Tensioner, Engine Timing Chain
1 O-ring, Oil Pick-up Tube
1 Gasket, Engine Timing Cover
NOTE: Order two heater tube O-rings separately listed below for each repair.
Part Number Description
53013736AA O-ring, Heater Tube (order two per vehicle)
Each dealer
to whom vehicles in the recall were assigned will receive enough Engine Timing Chain Packages to service about 5% of those vehicles.

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Recall type:

Customer Satisfaction Notification - Customer Satisfaction Notifications are preventive in nature and involve warranty or customer satisfaction issues such as non-safety repairs. Chrysler will correct the problem, at no charge, even if the vehicle is out of warranty and you are not the original owner.

You can check if your vehicle is subject to the timing chain issue recall (or any other recall) by visiting the Chrysler website and entering your vehicle's VIN number. Visit: http://www.chrysler.com/en/mobile/webselfservice/

----------

We really want to thank everyone who wrote us, (Pietro), with their timing chain concerns. The engineering team has completed their work and the following statement has been released. If there are any questions, reach out to us on this forum as opposed to sending an email as that will be quicker.

Chrysler Group is launching a customer-service action to bolster timing-chain system durability in certain cars equipped with 5.7-liter HEMI® V-8 engines.

The decision follows an extensive investigation to determine the precise issue and appropriate remedy.
The investigation discovered the engine’s fuel-saving cylinder-deactivation technology may cause an adverse interaction with the timing-chain system. (Chrysler Group is unaware of any related injuries or accidents.) As a result, the Company will replace – at no cost to customers – the timing chains, tensioners and guides in certain vehicles built between Aug. 4, 2008 and July 10, 2012.

Affected are certain model-year 2009-2012 Dodge Charger and Chrysler 300 full-size sedans, and Dodge Challenger sport coupes. The scope is limited to vehicles equipped with 5-speed automatic transmissions and axle ratios of 3.06, 3.73 or 3.92.

Beginning this month, Chrysler Group will contact affected customers with instructions to schedule service appointments with their dealers.

Chrysler Group greatly appreciates the patience demonstrated by its customers while this issue was under investigation. The Company also values and shares the passion expressed on these pages by customers and fans alike.

Thanks,

DodgeCares
----------

Article: Timing Chain Failure on the Dodge Challenger – Ground Zero

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#2,322 · (Edited)
Nah, I'm not one to think it's a minor issue or that it affects a negligible amount of cars, but I went ahead and bought an auto anyway because that's what I wanted/needed. I'd be more comfortable with an official and definitive resolution, but the posts above likely contain the explanation. Just drive in AutoStick and tunethe MDS out (when the '13 is tunable) and you should be fine (I realize how the conditional sounds, but it applies to all things mechanical, right?).

In my area manuals were hard to find on the lots and when I researched the 6-speed I found issues with the rear end whine, wheel hop, and some hard shifting. If you can't win either way you might as well stick to what you really want! I would not risk using MDS mode ever again, though, but it's just me - I'll keep the car a while and put a lot of miles on it.
 
#2,330 ·
I completely agree with this information and I think that at the end of the day when this major problem is finally resolved that it ends up being something to do with Harmonics with the MDS on at Highway Speed as the culprit.


Chrysler should have done what Harley Davidson did and that is to allow Oil to load the Tensioner. The Oil could not be compressed so it makes for a more consistant tensioned and smoother running chain.


I believe if it was a case of harmonics, we would see a much wider range of failures being the engine is used in so many applications.

Using Harley Davidson as an example of reliability is...............
well just plain funny
 
#2,331 ·
I believe if it was a case of harmonics, we would see a much wider range of failures being the engine is used in so many applications.
I disagree. The harmonics would vary by cam and by RPM that the driver ran the engine at. Maybe Ram 1500 runs a higher RPM keeping out of the harmonic slap of the chain.

I do like your tension idea though. My Honda CBR tensioner was a simple spring loaded screw jack type and that chain did make alot of clicking noises. My Toyota had an oil dampened belt tensioner (v6) but maybe that is totally different.
 
#2,333 ·
Speaking from personal experience and my observations over the last 35 years, Ive had some which were flawless and some not so wonderful mainly the AMF years. So using that reasoning being I have owned numerous Mopars with no problems, none of them have problems?? I do agree it is definatley tune related (computer), because the Charger is exactly the same mechanically and the issue does not exist.
 
#2,336 ·
That's what got we "wondering". VVT=skinny chaim/assy.

Not that it will make a difference on our 5.7's, but if Chrysler spent the time/money on developing a new SC motor, it would be nice to have a "fix" for the TC issues, and not just forget about them until a repair is needed.

Frustrating situation still
 
#2,340 ·
Wow 237 pages now.
 
#2,341 ·
I asked my master tech for the latest on the timing chains and he advised that it is effecting VVT engines whether auto or manual. He believes it's partially the oiler?? and the chain is significantly smaller than the chains in the older hemis. He advised that it's far from epidemic but if the chain breaks you're looking at a 5K plus repair if you're out of warranty.

That being said, how many of you will sell your hemi before the warranty runs out?
 
#2,342 ·
I asked my master tech for the latest on the timing chains and he advised that it is effecting VVT engines whether auto or manual...
Haven't heard of a single instance of a manual transmission shedding the timing chain yet under normal (or abusive) conditions yet. Did I miss one somewhere?
 
#2,343 ·
Considering that the manuals have the same chains, I seriously doubt the chain is the issue since the manuals do not have this failure problem. Just the fact that the tension shoe seems to break, that should be the direction we should be looking. During these failures, do the chains actually break or do they just jump track?
 
#2,347 ·
I traded mine in after the third motor failure. I even had the life time power train warranty. When the service rep called and told me my car was ready I picked it up and literally drove it out the the Dodge dealership and into the Ford dealership right down the road and got rid of it on a new Fx4 truck. Had enough with Chrysler and there lack of loyalty to the customer. This motor problem isn't going away it's only going to get worse over time as you pile up the mileage. I feel for those that will be out of warranty when their engine expires and your left holding the bill. If it were me I would unload it while you still can. Good luck....
 
#2,350 ·
I traded mine in after the third motor failure. I even had the life time power train warranty. When the service rep called and told me my car was ready I picked it up and literally drove it out the the Dodge dealership and into the Ford dealership right down the road and got rid of it on a new Fx4 truck. Had enough with Chrysler and there lack of loyalty to the customer. This motor problem isn't going away it's only going to get worse over time as you pile up the mileage. I feel for those that will be out of warranty when their engine expires and your left holding the bill. If it were me I would unload it while you still can. Good luck....
Here's where Chrysler is shooting themselves in both feet...................customer loyality.

The wife and I are considering a new truck this Spring. Dodge's "Lengendary HEMI" now has a different meaning to both of us................................wonder why??

I guess we both feel that if Chrysler is staying "mum" about the Challenger TC issue, our check book will stay "mum" for another Chrysler product.

Sales and marketing 101.......................customer loyalty has to be earned.

Are you listening at all Chrysler?
 
#2,348 · (Edited)
it's funny, the same dealer where the salesman admitted to me he knew about an issue with the timing chain, I talked with the service manager and he said they had never had any 5.7Hemi in for a timing chain problem, ever.
he's either a good actor or it's just not been seen by this dealer in DFW and had never heard of it.
 
#2,349 ·
And I was sure that the world would end yesterday so I made all kinds of short-term decisions lately... like buy an auto R/T without extended warranty! :worried:
 
#2,352 · (Edited)
Well you could be on to something about customer geography, diver88. Some places are really flat as far as hwy driving, while others have lots of up/down hills, while others have long grades. That could mean a lot as far as sustained/repetitive load on an mds system which may be prone to premature wear in certain components.
 
#2,355 ·
Another aspect to this is if you are willing to catch it early (preventatively), it may not even be a chain change, at all. It could be as simple as swapping in a new tensioner part. Maybe that is a more simple operation?
 
#2,357 ·
Another aspect to this is if you are willing to catch it early (preventatively), it may not even be a chain change, at all. It could be as simple as swapping in a new tensioner part. Maybe that is a more simple operation?
Randy,

You are correct, the one chain I replaced that didn't break appeared fine, most likely could have been re-installedm but for the money, a new chain is a good insurance policy. As far as being a simpler process, you have to remove the oil pump to gain access to the guideshoe, which by itself, isn't a big deal. The real challenge is the oil pickup tube. It has to be removed from the pump in order to slide the pump assy of the crank snout. I figured out a procedure to remove the pickup without having to remove the oil pan, but it is a real SOB........
 
#2,358 · (Edited by Moderator)
there are hundreds of thousands of these engines out there with MDS and VVT, what is different on the Challenger that is causing the failure??? if it was strictly MDS there would be failures across the board, same for if it was specifically the chain and /or tensioner and VVT. it is something in the Challenger tune etc not the mechanical parts, there are many Chargers trucks etc with over a hundred thousand miles on them
 
#2,359 ·
there are hundreds of thousands of these engines out there with MDS and VVT, what is different on the Challenger that is causing the failure??? if it was strictly MDS there would be failures across the board, same for if it was specifically the chain and /or tensioner and VVT. it is something in the Challenger tune etc not the mechanical parts, there are many Chargers trucks etc with over a hundred thousand miles on them
There also haven't been any failures on non-MDS Challengers or Challengers with MDS disabled.
 
#2,360 · (Edited)
As usual, we're the blind men around the elephant: it's likely to be a perfect storm of factors, not just one smoking gun. Aggressive MDS programming on the Challenger (guessing, as I have no idea), on top of the smaller chain on the VVT engines, on top of the jerking and/or imbalance caused by MDS/4 cylinder operation, on top of certain driving conditions like steady highway cruising, on top of...? Taken separately, none of those features seems to be problematic in what is largely seen as a bulletproof engine and this is why we see so much denial, but the numbers and low miles in the cases of failures point to a bad combo.
I'm guessing that addressing any of the contributing factors could be a fix, more of a bandaid, but a fix all the same. So tune the MDS out, drive in AutoStick, reinforce the chain tensioner assembly, change the MDS programming... there's options it looks like. For us, and in the face of deafening silence, the first two options are readily available. It's based on that assumption (because that's all it is regardless of the strong correlations) that I went ahead and bought an auto R/T. I was also banking on a tune being available soon, and it's a gamble.

We've already established that auto Hemi Challengers are failing. Bringing up how well other vehicles that happen to share an engine type, or MDS, or transmission, with them do is barely relevant. Few auto Hemi Challengers are likely to be up there in mileage right now. Focusing on just one of the factors (like MDS, or Hemi) and pointing to its track record on other vehicles is just muddying the waters at this point in the game. The thread would be shorter if we didn't go round and round. The fatter the better, though, as it has to be embarrassing, but side discussions, wild conjectures (like techs who think that oil provides tension) and redundancies do get in the way of a solution... if it has to come from us.
 
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#2,363 ·
"and in the face of deafening silence".

I find that quite Ironic. This an excerpt of what I sent Gilles and Forte Dec 12th rattling their cages over the chains. They are SRT gents true but my experience with them both tells me they care more than any here will ever know and they work closely with the R/T line.

" I'd like to think this is and has been dead center on someone's scope there for a long long time and that there is no need to invade your work day. But, one never knows here cuz the corporate silence remains deafening despite the pleas and paranoia of auto MDS owners one of which I am not thank God this time.
 
#2,361 ·
Everyone needs to quit looking for cause & effect..
Thats Chrysler's job.. They haven't done it & are NOT going to..

Common factor is MDS.
Plain, simple, short & sweet.

Do what you need to do to alleviate it!

Geez! Enough BS already!
 
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#2,362 ·
It seems like the long commutes that Hemi09Challenger R/T did really exacerbated the problem. Of course, it shouldn't have. So hopefully someone at Mopar is looking into this.

But to keep things in perspective. This is from another forum:
6.1L HEMI Average Weekly Demand for Timing Chains: 8
5.7L HEMI Average Weekly Demand for Timing Chains: 34
5.7L VVT HEMI Average Weekly Demand for Timing Chains: 28

We have to keep in mind that some of these chains will be ordered by folks who abused their cars. I am not suggesting that anyone who reported it on this thread did that. All I am saying it that some people do and will cause failures other than the ones reported here... And keep in mind that there are thousands if not hundred of thousands HEMIs out there.
 
#2,364 · (Edited)
It seems like the long commutes that Hemi09Challenger R/T did really exacerbated the problem. Of course, it shouldn't have. So hopefully someone at Mopar is looking into this.

But to keep things in perspective. This is from another forum:
6.1L HEMI Average Weekly Demand for Timing Chains: 8
5.7L HEMI Average Weekly Demand for Timing Chains: 34
5.7L VVT HEMI Average Weekly Demand for Timing Chains: 28
So were there the same number of 5.7 engines manufactured as there were 5.7VVT engines? (the weekly demand is so close)

This info is incorrect, the same chain is used for VVT and Non-VVT engines. The total for December 2012 is 33 per Luke in post 2662 on 1-14-13.
 
#2,368 ·
Well, maybe this is useful.

It seems that in the case of the failure that the chain and guide shoe break. Do they break at the same time or does one break before the other? It is doubtful that they break at the same time but one's failure is surely related to the other's failure. Given that, would it seem likely that the broken chain breaks the guide shoe? Or the broken quide show breaks the chain? I cannot see how a broken chain can break the shoe. If the chain were to break, it would all of a sudden lose tension and ball up in the timing chain area. But if the guide shoe were to break, I can see that forcing the chain to break in that all tension would be lost and the chain would try to ride on top of the sprockets. At that point if the chain could not fit around the outside of the sprockets unmeshed, then something would have to give. Either the chain or the sprockets. This is the more likely scenario and would prove that the chain is not failing due to it being a single roller.

If my above hypothesis were to be correct, then we would have to figure out why the guide shoe breaks. Does it wear out? Is it holding tension? Is the chain slapping it causing it to break?

The whole reason for this rant is to rule out chain strength. I firmly believe that no matter how strong the chain is, it would be breaking in these motors anyway due to another failure. I thing we should be focusing on that instead of talking about another engine having a duplex or triplex chain and that is somehow superior. While those chains may be stronger, I firmly believe the current chain is far stronger than it has to be to do the job.

Peace out!
 
#2,369 · (Edited)
Mainly from Desert Bum's analysis I also concluded that the tensioner assembly breaks and that the chain follows. There's been motors opened where the shoe was in bad shape while the chain was still OK. So a stronger chain wouldn't hurt, but it doesn't seem to be the source of problem. Unless I missed anything, the speculation revolves around whether the MDS operation generates vibrations that resonate with the tensioner, or a jerking of the chain (on/off MDS) that stresses it. In and of themselves vibrations aren't always destructive, but when you put together those that come with the MDS operation and the chain failures that only occur on certain MDS-equipped engines...

And I'm no mechanic but I doubt that the oil screen is a factor - I think it's just a minor and colateral victim of the excessive vibrations, either from the MDS or from the chain slapping around as the tensioner/guideshoe is disintegrating (probably the former as I think that at least one was found dislodged inside a healthy motor).

Those annoyed at how active and long-running this thread is can always unsubscribe, eh? I personally think it's important to keep it alive. One, someone could eventually have an epiphany, and two,... it is harder to ignore for Chrysler. I would love for an official to chime in and state that we're full of it and what is really going, or not going, on (I'm a dreamer) - too bad they have people on other boards, but not this one.
 
#2,371 ·
why is it limited to 30,000 R/Ts?????? the SAME engine with MDS VVT is used in the 300 Charger RAM Jeep with no mechanial failures on vehicles with much higher mileage. it has to be tune related, slamming the MDS on and off or possibly advancing retarding timing excessively, something unique to the Challenger.

If the guide shoe was wearing out it would happen on all models across the board or an inadequate chain would also be failing at a higher rate on high mileage vehicles.

also 1 in 250 is really exagerated, if it was anywhere near that upon searching the internet there would be reports on consumer sites etc. about the only ones are on this site. people complain about everything on the internet from washing machines to you name it. you really htink thier 30000 dollar car failing would not get posted?
 
#2,372 ·
So, does this affect the 12 or 13 R/T automatics in any way? Im sure this has been discussed somewhere in this thread but I am not going to read 200+ pages of anyone's thread!! hell no!!

I would appreciate some infod. I just sold my 2010 SE in hopes of getting a 12/13 R/T automatic. Thanks.
 
#2,376 ·
I wonder if doing an oil analysis at every oil change could give some indication that the chain and tensioner are heading toward failure. Would there be metal or plastic shavings in the oil?
 
#2,377 ·
I wonder if doing an oil analysis at every oil change could give some indication that the chain and tensioner are heading toward failure. Would there be metal or plastic shavings in the oil?
It could, but it would be hard to establish a "baseline" reading that had a level of plastic particals to measure against in the future. What level would be "normal" or acceptable??

If the count went up all the time, that would tell something, but we still wouldn't know what level a "normal" wearing tensioner should be at, and what level of contamination shows a failure coming soon.

Good point though
 
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