Timing chain failure on the Dodge Challenger

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts

not blowing anything off, in 5 years that i have been here never seen a broken timing chain, never!!!!!!
the 5.7L found in the Challenger is the same engine found in the Ram, Charger, 300 & Grand Cherokee, not that many Challengers around, but that engine is out there in large quantities, last time i spoke to my field service engineer, questioned him regarding timing chain failure, he stated never even heard of one failing, does it happen probably, but 3 out of several million engines, does it matter....nope

Nobody said it was only 3 that failed. I find it strange that 3 people found and posted to this thread with the same problem in less than a month. If every owner of a HEMI was on this forum and posted and there were only 3 with problems that would be one thing...but 3 people out of a small percentage of the market, represented by the forum, isn't a statistic anyone can go by...other than there ARE people seeking out others that had the same problem.

Am I worried? No. My Ram hasn't had any problems with the DPF plugging up or the turbo getting stuck, does that mean the multitude of people that have are just subject to the "Bummer, crap happens" attitude? I appreciate that you're here and have as well as provide a lot of insight into what's going on, but on the flip side I think you're being too quick to shrug this off as a random problem simply because you haven't seen it personally. I've never seen a tornado here in southern California, but I know they've happened. This timing chain problem is too coincidental to be a random, crap happens problem.

all you have to do is talk to any tech in a large dealership, he'll tell you in a hurry the issues we have....the new gen hemi's are kick ass engines, any engine pushed to the limit can and will break, doesnt necessarily make it a bad engine...

Luke

I agree, the HEMI is an awesome engine. However, having worked at a shop that did warranty work for a German auto maker, I can also tell you that a lot of common problems can be regional. Being the only shop in northern Arizona to provide warranty work, we were pretty busy. One of the most common problems we'd see were timing belt failures before they were supposed to be replaced at 60k miles. We literally had a continuous pile of heads sitting out back waiting to be shipped back to the manufacturer. Now, had you asked a large shop in another region that wasn't in a hot, dry area if they see a lot of premature timing belt failures the answer would be no.

Of course, these timing chain failures aren't a regional problem but my point is simply that you can't take a sampling of one or two shops, or one region, and apply your findings to everyone. If you were in Phoenix and never saw problems with the keyless door handles failing because it never rained, would you be quick to state there's no problem and they must be isolated and not a real problem? I'd hope not.

There are 3 documented problems in this thread alone in less than a month. I wouldn't be so quick to blame it on simply being a random problem or due to "operator error" because the engine was pushed too hard. That's rather presumptuous on your part and those impacted that haven't driven their car hard might take offense to such a statement, or even feel like you're sounding like a "typical dealer" that's "part of the problem."

Our local dealer tried to pull the same thing on my wife and I about the brakes on her Caravan. "Nobody else is having these problems, you must not be driving properly." Awesome way to make someone's blood boil, especially when the problem is well documented.

Like I said, I'm not saying this is a widespread problem, but CLEARLY there are people having failures and that simply needs to be acknowledged and not blown off as random or customer fault.

Would you consider it random of 3 people posted on here within a month that said their left front wheel fell off? That's a pretty major thing to happen, and pretty specific to be random, don't you think?

[stevewhiteparts]

timing chain total weekly demand for 5.7L is 18, in the real world that is a totally insignificant number....considering the number of years of fitment and the range of fitment
Luke

[stevewhiteparts]

to put this in perspective, how many se owners with 3.5L have had an issue with rocker shafts or upper valve train noise, part fits 2 years, weekly demand is 759, now there is an issue,.....i dont see any 3.5L Challenger owners complaining about it
Luke

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts

timing chain total weekly demand for 5.7L is 18, in the real world that is a totally insignificant number....considering the number of years of fitment and the range of fitment
Luke

Curious what the total weekly demand is for, say, crankshafts or other major hard parts. Maybe blocks as well. The timing chain numbers may be statistically insignificant for install base, but it truly isn't a part that should need to be replaced frequently. If there are nearly-equal numbers of cranks and blocks being ordered then I'd say there's no abnormal spike in demand, however if the demand for other hard parts is much lower then this does stand out as a potential problem, though on a much smaller scale.

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts

to put this in perspective, how many se owners with 3.5L have had an issue with rocker shafts or upper valve train noise, part fits 2 years, weekly demand is 759, now there is an issue,.....i dont see any 3.5L Challenger owners complaining about it
Luke

Can't use forums as the basis for the majority of owners, we are but a small fraction of the owners out there. Using any forum statistics and applying them to the entire install base is using flawed data. Clearly the fact that "nobody" on here is complaining about it is not proof that there's no problem. You obviously know it's a problem, yet now you're saying that nobody is complaining about it on here...

So no complaints and there's a known problem...
But people complain and it's not a problem...

Again, all I'm saying is that the attitude of "I haven't seen it so it must not be a problem." doesn't help anyone and it certainly doesn't help the people reporting their problems feel like those that are in a position to help care about them or the problem.

The issue I have here is about attitude, not the numbers.

[stevewhiteparts]

the way warranty works, the failed part is coded as the causal, hence if a timing chain is the issue and caused the engine failure, the timing chain is coded as the causal,

crankshaft demand is " 1 " a week, short block assembly is 21 a week, fits 08 thru 12
Luke

[raVenX]

Originally Posted by LexHemi

Hey guys.. I found this forum because I was searching after the timing chain on my 2010 Challenger (22,600 miles) with a 5.7 Hemi broke while traveling at around 75 mph on the interstate two days ago. We coasted over to the emergency lane and I had to get it towed to a dealer...

Thank you for taking the time to register with the forum and pass along your experience. Sorry to hear about your plight and I hope it all gets worked out as soon as possible for you.

Maybe come back and give us all an update from time to time while your car is getting repaired.

By the way, where about are you?

[raVenX]

Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts

timing chain total weekly demand for 5.7L is 18, in the real world that is a totally insignificant number....

18 x 52 = 936 a year. Multiply that by 3 years (2009, 2010, 2011) and you get 2,808. That's NOT an insignificant number, and at least 75% of those, I'm sure, required a new engine, the most expensive component in the vehicle. Other than a car wreck, I can't think of a reason why you would order and replace a timing chain unless there was a failure, i.e., the timing chain broke. I'm sure there is, I just can't think of any and certainly none more convincing that it breaking.

Also, while it's true the 5.7L has been around since 2003 as you stated, this particular 5.7L configuration has only been around since 2009. Many things changed beginning in 2009, including a newly designed timing chain tensioner and the timing chain itself which I believe was replaced with a new much thinner timing chain.

But really, none of that matters. Your mind is obviously made up. 18 years, 5 years, whatever it is that your have worked as a mechanic, and your never have seen a timing chain break before in a Challenger is really of no concern. I don't suppose all of those who have experienced a timing chain break was instructed to notify you. I posted 3 cases of a timing chain break just inside of 2 months and now a 4th has come forward within that same time frame, and that's just in this thread. I believe I have 6-7 other cases logged. For something that both you and I agree seems sooo rare, 6-7 cases is rather shocking to me. Now you tell us that it may be as high as 18 per week. I am left just scratching my head in bewilderment.

Let the thread do what it was intended to do and find out if there is, in fact, a problem occurring. Could it just be a coincidence that all of these timing chains are breaking around the same time? Sure, that's possible. But rather than just shake your head and say no, no, no, let's let the thread take its course and let's see how many more post up their experience with a broken timing chain.

[stevewhiteparts]

Originally Posted by raVenX

18 x 52 = 936 a year. Multiply that by 3 years (2009, 2010, 2011) and you get 2,808. That's NOT an insignificant number, and at least 75% of those, I'm sure, required a new engine, the most expensive component in the vehicle. Other than a car wreck, I can't think of a reason why you would order and replace a timing chain unless there was a failure, i.e., the timing chain broke. I'm sure there is, I just can't think of any and certainly none more convincing that it breaking.

Also, while it's true the 5.7L has been around since 2003 as you stated, this particular 5.7L configuration has only been around since 2009. Many things changed beginning in 2009, including a newly designed timing chain tensioner and the timing chain itself which I believe was replaced with a new much thinner timing chain.

But really, none of that matters. Your mind is obviously made up. 18 years, 5 years, whatever it is that your have worked as a mechanic, and your never have seen a timing chain break before in a Challenger is really of no concern. I don't suppose all of those who have experienced a timing chain break was instructed to notify you. I posted 3 cases of a timing chain break just inside of 2 months and now a 4th has come forward within that same time frame, and that's just in this thread. I believe I have 6-7 other cases logged. For something that both you and I agree seems sooo rare, 6-7 cases is rather shocking to me. Now you tell us that it may be as high as 18 per week. I am left just scratching my head in bewilderment.

Let the thread do what it was intended to do and find out if there is, in fact, a problem occurring. Could it just be a coincidence that all of these timing chains are breaking around the same time? Sure, that's possible. But rather than just shake your head and say no, no, no, let's let the thread take its course and let's see how many more post up their experience with a broken timing chain.

whatever, you win i give up.............guys dont buy Challengers cause timing chains break
i'll trade mine for a Mustang today..............not

lol

Luke

[USponycar]

Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts

whatever, you win i give up.............guys dont buy Challengers cause timing chains break
i'll trade mine for a Mustang today..............not

lol

Luke

I don't know. I beat the snot out of my GT and the engine just asked for more after 115,000 miles. Having timing chain issues at 22,000+ miles is absurd. While I don't own a 5.7 anymore, isn't the 6.4 basically a larger displacement version of the 5.7 as far as design goes? I sure hope they beefed up the timing chain.
Oops, correction, I do own a 5.7 in my Grand Cherokee.