Timing chain failure on the Dodge Challenger

[sick'r bee]

I'll give Revotech a call, see what he's heard as he is the one who came up with the star center " replace too thick grease" on the early 6-speeds. He ALSO talked me into a catch can on the 5.7 as he had replaced a LOT of intakes due to that little none problem, tho they usually go ( intake silicone seals deteriated due to oil puddles under PCV inlet), out under a covered warranty repair id rather not worry bout it. My problem is like RavenX stated, if it's happening and being repaired with the same parts there IS the possibility of having it happen 3-4 times in the 100k warranty, NOT a very comforting thought.

[bacdoc11]

Your right, guys don’t buy Challengers because the timing chains break…we buy them because we wanted to believe that Chrysler had finally gotten it right and made the most unique and well designed and manufactured “retro� car. I had a 72 Challenger and loved it, great car and never once gave me an issue. Every Chrysler product I have had since then has been a mistake. But I heard good things about the Challenger and really liked the looks of the car so I took a chance and bought another Chrysler product…what a mistake!

I couldn't agree more with raVenX on this matter. After I first posted and got the response that I did it made my blood boil. The attitude of one person on this forum is exactly what keeps others from sharing their experiences because it just isn't worth it to argue with an idiot because they will only drag you down to their level and end up beating you with their experience....

It takes a lot of time out of a day to come here read other peoples posts and then sign up and post your experience. We are here because we are experiencing problems with our cars that we want to find answers to. When my timing chain failed I thought that was an odd thing so I “goggled it� and found this forum. Much to my surprise I found out that I wasn’t the only one who had this problem, and in fact I found several other web-sites that showed other people had the same problem.

The real problem is we purchased vehicles that are over $40,000, that the manufacture marketed to us as being “strip ready�, and some of us now have cars that have not been lived up to the “hype�. In my case I have only smoked the tires 3 times, I have never topped it out, and I drive 110 miles to work 4 days a week and 95 of those miles in highway travel. I never rag on it, have not gotten a speeding ticket in this car, nor had one in the last 30 years. My case isn’t about me abusing the car or being to hard on it…my case is about this car being a piece of “s*#t�. I have had nothing but troubles with this car since I first bought it. It all started when it would randomly not start and the key fob’s wouldn’t unlock the doors. I had the key fobs replaced 4 times and within a few weeks I would have the same problems all over again. I had it in the dealership on 5 occasions for this problem and was seriously looking at what recourse I had under the “lemon law� because no one could fix the problem. The dealership kept telling me that they have never heard of this type of a problem and they use this exact type of key fob on a number of Chrysler products. They were baffled and the last time I took it in they ended up with the car for 27 days before they finally got it fixed. Just like the person here who says “they never seen one or heard of that� I was accused of making things up until I finally had it happen and was able to take the car to the dealership so they could see it first hand. After all of their talk about that they didn’t know what the problem was and had never heard of it imagine my surprise when looking for answers to my timing chain issue to find that there were service bulletins about this key fob issue dated prior to my problems and yet the dealership lied to me telling me that they couldn’t find any information about this being a known issue. So excuse me if I don’t “trust� the dealership, mechanics or others who claim that they have never seen something.

In regards to my timing chain repairs I got screwed by Chrysler. After the dealership tore down my engine they determined that the valves needed to be replaced because they were bent from impacting the pistons and that was all the damage to the motor. They told me that the pistons were scuffed, but otherwise they were ok and that they were not going to replace them. I contacted Chrysler and asked that s senior field rep contact me. Never heard from the person, he called the dealership and they agreed that the pistons weren’t damaged and they put my car back together without ever consulting me. Now I am not a mechanic but I do have some knowledge…it is called “common sense� which seems to be lacking in most mechanics today. Anytime two pieces of metal collide with each other with enough force to bend one of them and cause a “scuffing� on the other there is no way that you can guarantee the structural integrity of those parts. If this was a drag car and the same thing happened the owner would do a complete rebuild of the engines internal parts. Why because there is no way they can determine if one or all of those internal moving parts were bent or damaged, even slightly. Not in this case, they put the car back together and I am stuck with it till it fails again…which it will.

Meanwhile, they have reported these “warranty repairs� to carfax and now my vehicle has this “black mark� against it when I go to sell it. It has this “major engine repair� and I for one would be less inclined to purchase this car, but I certainly wouldn’t pay the “maximum� for this particular car. Now that I have the car back (after 9 days) the car isn’t the same. The car never “shook� when sitting at a stop light, the gas mileage is decreased, and there is an obvious ticking noise in the head area. Crap does happen, but when crap happens fix the crap right the first time and don’t blame it on the driver.

I have a friend that has the exact same car, same year and when you drive his verses mine there is a difference, they sound different and both of them are 100% stock. The one thing I know is that if I were the owner of an auto parts supplier and one of my employees was posting on “forums� in the manner seen here that person would no longer be working for me… For those of us who have had the unfortunate “crap happens� experience as one person would have us believe I feel your pain as we know first hand that we no longer have “faith� in our vehicles.

[stevewhiteparts]

own many Gt Mustangs convertibles, my daughter blew the transmission drag racing on the street on the last one, except for constant replacing of wheel bearings, never had a problem, i dont baby my Challenger......

absurb thread, 18 failures a week is insignificant, 700+ is real problem, this site suffers from the same fate as many of these sites, bench racers that have never turned a wrench and know everything.....

I dont know anything!!!!

but been a manager in a dealership since i was 24, have drag race everything from street to supercomp, for the last 20 years race dirt cars, last 15 years raced dirt modifieds and everyday i learn something new.....

Luke

[LexHemi]

Originally Posted by raVenX

Thank you for taking the time to register with the forum and pass along your experience. Sorry to hear about your plight and I hope it all gets worked out as soon as possible for you.

Maybe come back and give us all an update from time to time while your car is getting repaired.

By the way, where about are you?

I purchased the car and live in Lexington, KY. The car is at a dealer in Lebanon, OH. Just spoke with the Service Mgr. They have ordered a new timing chain and are checking for other damage. Two bad/damaged valves so far... sigh.

I guess this is not a big deal for guys like Luke until it happens to them. This is a huge deal to me. I love this car. It was a big spend for me. Just didn't expect this kind of epic failure.

I will say this. The service department I'm working with seems to be on top of things. I feel pretty confident they are doing what needs to be done to make things right again.

Any advice on what to ask or look for as the repairs progress?

Thanks!

[Mark052]

Interesting thread, for sure. I'm curious to know if the affected engines were manufactured within a narrow time frame relative to each other or are they spread out over various model years.
Is it true that the newer hemi 5.7 (2009+) engine uses a much thinner timing chain compared to the older 5.7?

[RoostKing]

Originally Posted by stevewhiteparts

own many Gt Mustangs convertibles, my daughter blew the transmission drag racing on the street on the last one, except for constant replacing of wheel bearings, never had a problem, i dont baby my Challenger......

absurb thread, 18 failures a week is insignificant, 700+ is real problem, this site suffers from the same fate as many of these sites, bench racers that have never turned a wrench and know everything.....

I dont know anything!!!!

but been a manager in a dealership since i was 24, have drag race everything from street to supercomp, for the last 20 years race dirt cars, last 15 years raced dirt modifieds and everyday i learn something new.....

Luke

Luke, although we apprecieate the dealership side of the experience to the forum, Im not sure why you are sho staunchly in the "its not a problem" corner.

And you are right, many people have never turned a wrench, but isnt that the point when you buy a new car at $40,000 - $50,000??? The poster above you (BacDoc) is obviously not a kid and has had issues since day one, and he STILL cant get it right. Why, because the dealership has the same outlook as you, which gets in the way of getting things fixed. You say 18 Timing chain failures in a year, We have at least 3 posters in this thread with failures. Not saying its a wide spread problem, could be regional, could be a "batch" of bad timing chains, but with your, and seemingly most dealerships attitude that "The customer is an idiot" and "must" of been hot rodding it is why dealerships and the people that work there get no respect. Why not just say, "yea, there could be other variables involved".

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by RoostKing

You say 18 Timing chain failures in a year, We have at least 3 posters in this thread with failures.

It's actually 18 per week, though I don't think he said all these were failures. It was the weekly demand for the part. I still think that's a lot for a part that shouldn't need to be replaced. I can see the blocks being in higher demand as people want to build up their own engines, etc.

In any case, there's no denying multiple people on this thread have had timing chain failures. Luke can deny it all he wants, doesn't change the facts...but it might change who buys parts from him on here. Attitude goes a long way.

[Lashlarue]

The internet creates a phenomina, people stretch the truth or pass on second hand information or outright lie. Taurus pistols for example, they are built in Brazil in the former Beretta factory,which retained almost all the engineers, smiths and assembly people when sold to Taurus.Taurus then spent $20,000,000 to upgrade most of the equipment to state of the art cnc machines.Some of their new models had bugs that were quickly corrected in almost all cases. I tracked one complainer and he had posted at least 100 times using multiple user names about a "Judge" failure, that in reality had happened to the father of a friend of his.Ruger had similar problems, few complaints.I've read about these three timing chain failures on four different sites but they are the same three.The Mustang Cobra 96-98 has tremec T-45's,havent found one that didn't have second gear synchro troubles.Replaced tranny rear-end and fuel pump on my 97 inside of 35k.Traded it in 2002 for a used C5corvette 14k which was even more troublesome.I could write a book on that one.IF you heard of a problem on C5's. mine had them, all of them.

[2ndgen]

Originally Posted by Lashlarue

The internet creates a phenomina, people stretch the truth or pass on second hand information or outright lie. Taurus pistols for example, they are built in Brazil in the former Beretta factory,which retained almost all the engineers, smiths and assembly people when sold to Taurus.Taurus then spent $20,000,000 to upgrade most of the equipment to state of the art cnc machines.Some of their new models had bugs that were quickly corrected in almost all cases. I tracked one complainer and he had posted at least 100 times using multiple user names about a "Judge" failure, that in reality had happened to the father of a friend of his.Ruger had similar problems, few complaints.I've read about these three timing chain failures on four different sites but they are the same three.The Mustang Cobra 96-98 has tremec T-45's,havent found one that didn't have second gear synchro troubles.Replaced tranny rear-end and fuel pump on my 97 inside of 35k.Traded it in 2002 for a used C5corvette 14k which was even more troublesome.I could write a book on that one.IF you heard of a problem on C5's. mine had them, all of them.

This is a perfect demonstration of a proven psychological phenomenon:

Whether you hear an idea from 10 people, or the same idea repeated 10 times from one person, it has the same weight on the listener's mind. A rather fascinating phenomenon.

A video about conformity. [VIDEO]

[Walaby]

[QUOTE=Lashlarue;981334I've read about these three timing chain failures on four different sites but they are the same three.[/QUOTE]
That says alot. Now, I will admit for the three that this happened to, it is a big deal, and I also agree that if the pistons were scuffed on the one, they shoulda been replaced.

I don't know how many 5.7L Challengers have been sold, but 3 would be a microscopic percentage Im assuming. Nevertheless, it doesn't make the owners of these three feel any better.

Unfortunately, some things do happen. Heck, I remember a few years back the recall about missing front wheel bearings! I don't think any cars made it on the road (that I heard of), but yet I remember seeing a thread bashing Camaro's because they had something along the same lines. Now, I know it's not the same, but my point here is, sometimes things happen, despite the best quality that can be provided. Nobody and no auto manufacturer is perfect.

So, if the masses want to quit buy the Challenger because of these instances, well, that's fine.. I won't, and it will make my more noticeable the less that are on the road.

How the dealership handles the repair is what really matters. In the one case, with the scuffed piston, that's not right and I agree with the poster. I also don't think that any business would re-engineer and refabricate a part based on less than 1% failure rate. So, fact remains is, if your timing chain fails, you should expect it to be replaced by the same part.

Sorry to hear about the problems that some of you have had. Truly I am..

Mike