Dodge Challenger Forum banner

Wheel Hop

11K views 57 replies 21 participants last post by  randycat99 
#1 ·
I know you folks have covered this endlessly as I have read through a bunch of posts. unfortunately I have yet to find anything that says this is THE fix and have it be something that does not ruin the ride of the car.

Its seems like HopNot and Peddlers Bushings are the only 2 solutions I see any amount of time spent on here, so my first question is, is there any other solution you folks have tried with success and I have just missed it?

Here is my situation; 2011 RT Classic - MOPAR CAI - MOPAR/CORSA exhaust - DiabloSport 93 octane tune - 6 speed - STP w/3.92 - BFG G Force stock size tires.

I get the wheel hop like crazy but NEVER tire spin. Even if I ease out and then nail it I get hop, and if I hit 2nd hard its actually violent hop.

I have been digging through the countless threads about wheel hop and I'm not yet sold on any solution I have seen posted. In part because I like the ride of my car and don't want to ruin it with full race mods. And also in part because I don't see anyone saying that they have THE solution. Most of the posts talk about a partial fix, but nothing that leaves me feeling like I am ready to dump a ton of cash on a partial fix.

Hoping to find a decent solution and willing to pay whatever it costs, but dont want to experiment, I would prefer to bite the bullet on a big fix if it is a known solution that also does not kill the ride.

Wondering if tires are major factor to hop vs. spin vs. traction without hop ? At this point I'm almost thinking I would rather have something that has no traction than these tires that are on the virge of hooking up but beat the car to death. The wheel hop is bad enough I am concerned about honestly breaking something. Not fun,,,

Sorry to rehash if I have in fact missed the fix, but I find it hard to believe there is not one.

Thanks

GH
 
See less See more
#2 ·
Good question that's been beaten to death on the forum. I switched from F1 to Nitto Motivo and laid down two fat burnouts with no hop. I did not expect that to happen. Took off from a light very slow speed in first, clutch fully released and then floored it, that left stripes on the road for 30 feet. Fun!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flat Top
#3 ·
Beware on the wheel hop....

I had to have my differential replaced and I attribute that to too many wheel hop launches. There was a deaccel whine that you could easily hear, maybe not terrible, but annoying. There was no clunking or anything but when I took it in for diff service, they said metal debris was in the fluid and they didn't even bother with the service since the diff was trashed. It's better to burn the tires than to grip/bang/slip, grip/bang/slip, grip/bang/slip multiple times per second. I also switched from the factory RSA's to Nitto Motivo's and they are 60K tires which = harder rubber which = less traction and more tire burn. I think that's better than wheel hoppin'. It's not as good for 0-60's, quarter miles or country roads though.

As far as the fix goes, I too have read all those posts and it's confusing since some guys report problem fixed and others say not so much on all of the fixes. Based on my research, I don't think it's possible to eliminate wheel hop without a much harder ride and/or loss of traction. It's just the way these cars are. I keep looking for the definitive answer that gives us the best of all worlds.
 
#4 · (Edited)
Could it be the tire size? I had a 2012 RT for a couple years, 18 inch tires, never any wheel hop. In fact, when I read about people having wheel hop on the forum, I didn't know what it was. Now, I have a 2014 RT with 20 inch tires - I know what wheel hop is now. Also, I think most claim the 18 inch tires give you a smoother ride than the 20's. That, I can't confirm because I went from a regular RT to a Blacktop, which supposedly has a better suspension. If you don't mind trading rims and tires with someone, that might be your fix.
 
#9 ·
I don't know if its THE answer, but I would not be surprised to find its part of the issue.

I really love the look of my factor wheels and dont want give them up, but maybe there is an 18" version of my 20's

I'll have to do some research,,,

Thanks

GH

 
#7 ·
There's no one step solution to eliminate wheel hop. It takes a lot of money and labor. SX control arms, tension arms, and replacement of all the soft rubber cradle bushings in the rear (especially the rear cradle and differential) and you got a good shot on eliminating it.

With my mods, it's a lot more under control, but not gone by any means. Different tires only addresses the symptom, not the underlying issue of all the rubber bushings that make up the rear suspension.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Just reading your posts about your efforts to address wheel hop and I tip my hat to you. You are persistent and clearly putting your best effort into this.

Unfortunately, your experience is EXACTLY what I don't want to go through.

I don't mind spending dollars for a proven solution but so far there does not seem to be one. I see lots of potential improvements, but nothing that looks like THE fix just yet.

The part that rubs me the wrong way the most is the discussion about the negative impact to the ride. Mine is plenty stiff enough with the STP option for my taste. Not sure what others are judging their ride quality by, but I'm too old/worn out to have go-kart quality ride and I didn't spend all this money for a modern muscle car to have 1960's beat you to death ride.

Having used poly suspension bushings in the past I do not think this is the right direction for most folks. My experience is BAD ride, noise, constantly loosening bolts and poor wear qualities. Maybe they are better today, but in the past they were better suited to race cars than something you want to get tens of thousands of mile's of service out of. Not sure if harder rubber bushings are an option???

At the same time I find it hard to believe its not possible to clear the problem up. There are way too many modern cars out there that run just as fast/hard without parts breaking wheel hop.

Wonder what the actual drag cars are doing, tossing out the whole back end and bolting in a 4-link w/coilovers and Dana 60??? Probably cost less than what some folks seem to be paying for partial solutions, but still not what I'm looking for,,,

GH
 
#13 ·
Its not that likely - they're torqued to a fairly high level (the exact number I don't have at hand...using another computer other than my home one with all that info on it...)
that is over 100 ft-lb of torque...they're fairly substantial bolts.
 
#14 ·
In my research, my opinion is :
1 - the Razors Edge tension arms and adjustable control arms. Users report a great reduction in wheel hop. Plus different tires than the stock ones. Nittos seem to be a good choice.

2 - get an automatic, and enjoy the new paddle shifters

I plan to do one of these.

Peace
 
#19 ·
I would consider option 1 if there was enough collective feedback that it made a very noticeable improvement.

As for option 2, well given that one of the reasons I bought the car was I wanted a manual trans and old school pistol grip shifter thats not a likely fix for me. Plus I HATE paddle shifters! They belong on go-karts where you cant fit a decent floor shifter. :grin2:

Actually, I have to admit that I am so old school, I HATE the hydraulic clutch, if there was a kit to switch to mechanical linkage that would be the first item on my to do list! :notallthere:

GH
 
#15 ·
I had these same issues when I bought my 09 srt new. A big problem are the F1 tires, historically have have a bad rep for wheel hop in irs cars. Gto's have had the same issue, get rid for them tires! They are junk! I've ran bg Goodrich kdw's, nittos, and mickeys are they all improve the wheel hop problem alone. After I had done that I also got just the Hop Not Stage 1 kit and with just these two simple changes I almost never get wheel hop. dry or wet it doesn't matter, the extremely rare times I do get it is so little and un often it doesn't bother me even, like maybe twice a year I experience it. drag racing and street duty. I love doing burnouts! Its just a great time, tire company's like me to as I go threw a set of rear tires every year lol
 
#20 ·
I'm running BFG G-Force tires, not the FI's

I can see how the Hop Not could help, which begs the question if the root problem is defect in the factory bushings or their installation in some of the cars, or maybe just the wrong ones used in some cars.

This could help explain what some cars have a problem and others not. Has that been discussed/investigated?

GH
 
#16 ·
Is it possible the F1's have optimized for cornering performance (sidewall rigidity) to a point where they are not all that good for launch traction characteristics? So by just going to a different tire with more sidewall or less rigid sidewall, the wheel hop problem is naturally and significantly reduced?
 
#22 ·
Sure seems like tires play a role, but I suspect that they are not the root problem.

People seem to be changing lots of parts to address this issue, and it seems like the real reason they are is flex/movement of the rear cradle. And given that its only a problem for some it seems to lead back to bad or wrong bushings or some problem in the factory installation. Possibly bushings damaged during installation, bolts loosening up, or bushings wearing very prematurely??? (Mine only has 14K miles)

It seems very odd that the problem is so inconsistent.

And if mine is as bad as it is with a stock 5.7, what must it be like to drive an SRT or HellCat, or something highly modified. I could not actually race mine and get a decent time given how bad it is. If I drove through the hop without lifting the peddle for several hard 1/4 mile passes I'm sure something would break.

I love mine, but its only usable as a cruiser, full throttle acceleration from a stop, a low speed rolling start, or during shifting is not possible without violent wheel hop.

GH
 
#17 ·
Have never had wheel-hop issues with any of my Challengers, Charger or 300...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flat Top
#23 ·
EXACTLY my point! And the BIG question is WHY???

Why some and not others, very strange,,, Something just does not add up.

Seems like a ton of money is changing hands in an effort to fix something that should either happen to almost all of them or very few. Why the inconsistency?

Seems like Chrysler must have some idea. Are they just trying to avoid a recall???

GH
 
#21 ·
My theory on that is that if you punch it so hard to make wheel-hop emerge for the first time, it is the beginning of the end. Every time it happens things loosen up a tick more. Every incident makes the next one that much easier to emerge, until you have a rear suspension that does nothing but that.
 
#24 · (Edited)
Assuming you are correct, what was the root problem, bad bushings or bad bushing installation?

Are they selling HellCats with the same problem? If not what has been changed?

How are people running any sub 13 second ET's with such bad wheel hop? Seems very odd,,,

Seems to me that some people are suffering defective suspension problems while others have no such problem. It doesn't make sense.

GH

OK, probably more than enough for tonight,,, not going to solve anything by endlessly posting in frustration.
 
#25 ·
I have the full hop not kit installed on my 2010 m6 srt8, it did a great job at getting rid of the wheel hop, and paired with 275/40 20 nitto nt05's in the back I very rarely if ever get wheel hop any more. The issue I have now is trying to plant the power to the ground, the nt05's are not sticky enough, I'm at roughly 510 rwhp right now and its hard to contain. The eagle rs-a's were worthless.

But from what I can't tell so far is the hop not kit is pretty worth while, and some grippier tires make a big difference, and hasn't sacrificed ride quality either. The SRT stp suspension is pretty stiff from the factory.

The only thing I noticed after the hop not went on was more noise from the rear end (gear noise and occasional rattle) other than that, no clearance issues or anything
 
#27 ·
The stage one one just the rear cradle isolators, stage 2 is the addition of the gas shocks from the isolators to the suspension, and stage 3 is the addition of adjustable sway bar end links.
 
#28 ·
#30 ·
The only thing I can find from my discussions is replacing all the rear cradle bushings with either a poly bushing or a solid bushing

The rubber in the cradles are junk. But is is a lot of work to do
Multiple ways to remove them from a saw zall and a air chizzle to a 400 dollar miller press tool

That's all I know
Chris


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
 
#34 ·
The only thing I can find from my discussions is replacing all the rear cradle bushings with either a poly bushing or a solid bushing

The rubber in the cradles are junk. But is is a lot of work to do
Multiple ways to remove them from a saw zall and a air chizzle to a 400 dollar miller press tool

That's all I know
Chris


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
What suspension option did you select?

GH
 
#31 ·
i have the full hop not kit on my car. when i run my M&H drag radials and let the clutch fly from a dead stop, i get no hop. same for 90% of the time with the stock junk goodyears. in fact, just before i put her away for the winter, i went out and did a few long burnouts on a brand new blacktop road by my work on the near dead stock tires that i will be replacing in the spring. i got zero hop there too. the only time i can say my car will still hop is if i roll into spin. i feel it slightly then, but never as harsh as it was before putting the hopnot kit on. it even has less body roll now with the hopnot and really didnt sacrifice too much of the plush ride.

i know on some other forums, there are guys running the full hopnot kit and these and have claimed to eliminate it completely:

Speedlogix Billet Rear Tension Arms 05-13 Challenger, Charger, 300, Magnum
 
  • Like
Reactions: NavySRT
#35 ·
So did you install the whole HopNot kit at the same time or in stages?

And can you tell me what the "Larrys mod" is listed in your signature? I am running the factory shifter but with a classic pistol grip shifter handle.

Thanks Much

george
 
#36 ·
george

i havn't replaced the cradle bushings yet.. it is a lot of work and i don't want to dismantle the whole rear end right now.

i put spohn performance control arms and swaybar end links on but that won't fix it.

hop not is a bandage that really don't work that well either

the LARRY'S mod you see is a guy in mn that makes aftermarket throw rods that replace the junk shifter rod that comes with the hurst shifter for our cars.

super nice guy to deal with

chris
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flat Top
#40 ·
I like the idea of the control arms and sway bar links, but I am concerned that my issue is so bad I can't help but wonder if I have a bad cradle bushing. Clearly I need to get it up on a lift to check before throwing money and parts at it.

As for the shifter, did you see a big difference in shifting with the new setup? I really dont have any problems except that the gate to 5/6 is very heavy, otherwise no issues.

Can you point me to this guy Larry, I would be interested to see what he is offering.

Thanks for the words of wisdom.

George
 
#37 ·
For all of the hop not kits, you don't have to take out the bushings, you just trim them down, its still a PITA but you don't have to drop the rear cradle or anything. you just need to trim the rubber.

The total install took me about 2 hours with a lift, it would have taken a little longer if I had to do it on jack stands.
 
#41 ·
Were you able to tell if your bushings were ok?

Seems to me one of the reasons some folks have really good success with the HopNot kit and for others it was only a partial fix is that they may have had problems with their bushings???

George
 
#38 ·
Wheel hop seems to be related to right side "walk out" which occurs on most IRS rears, and while the cradle bushings giving is the cause of it, most of us don't want to change them out right now. I was suprised that merely changing the rear sway bar LINKS from the tiny OEM to the Spohn, SEEMS to have eliminated 90% of the right side hop (which IS the side that is on videos), don't think I've ever seen a left side hop.
 
#43 ·
^^^ Yes knock on wood, I have checked mine so far they are K and the reason I replaced my rear sway bar links was as I changed to Daytona/Police rear brakes about 14 months ago, I noticed that the rubber in the links was already cracked pretty bad, so replaced them with the Spohns an was SUPRISED that it stopped/slowed the walkout but just drive or ride in a Challenger with either solids or poly cradle bushings I you can really feel the differance! Replace ALL the rubber eventually is my goal, about $200 diff between poly or solids though so have not decided the route, if I had damaged OEM would go with Whitelines, since I will be using them for all the other rubber in car BUT will be ready for lots of squeaks from every bushing that MOVES in winter though, nature of the beast since I just heard my first from the Hotchkis front sways bushings down in the 30s here! ;)
 
#44 ·
i tried to find his web site.. he used to be a vendor on hear. it was g&k performance he is out of mn

there are people selling the hurst with the throw rod mod already done.. or you can send him yours..

there is a big difference between his rod set up and the junk hurst.. it is a much improvement over the stock hurst.

chris
 
#45 ·
Riddle me this folks... I have the stage I Hopnot kit... On the street, 99.5% no hop... hooks up 75% of the time... on the track.... I can't make a single pass without hop/spin - WHY such a huge difference from the street to the track?


My F1's weren't as bad as my Pirellis... I am thinking about trying out the BFG G-Force Comp 2's...
 
#49 ·
Is it possible humidity is a wildcard factor on tire behavior (particularly, traction "behavior")? I'll certainly agree, it seems unlikely it should make a difference. To really split hairs, maybe humidity isn't a really good term since it implies a condition of the air. What about "moisture" of the pavement (which may/may not be influenced by air humidity)?...the difference between dusty and bone dry vs. just short of damp?
 
#47 ·
That's weird. Mine doesn't hop at the track at all really. Maybe a little on the shift into 2nd sometimes.

It does hop on the street sometimes though.

I'm running Firestone wide oval indy 500 tires.


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App
How was your 13' R/T... I have the same set up 6 spd/ STP....
 
#48 ·
I only had my '13 R/T at the track once and it had the stock Goodyear F1 tires on it. I definitely did have wheel hop problems that day...but I was eventually able to work around them and run a 13.27 in the 1/4.


I ended up putting Firestone Wide Oval Indy 500's on that car too but never ran it at the track with them. I don't recall having bad wheel hop problems with those tires on the street.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top