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General Challenger Discussion This section contains general discussion about the Dodge Challenger. If it does not fit into a more specific area, it probably belongs in here. (Dodge Challenger General Discussion)

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2012, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by RoostKing View Post
True Story. I was reading your post and I immediately thought "California". Look to the right of you post, and sure enough, Temecula, Ca.
Me having realistic views on privacy is related to where I live? That's interesting...
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Old 12-09-2012, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Yahooligan View Post
Uh, no...

EDRs don't replace other evidence. Obviously if someone ran a stop sign then they would be at fault. Let's not lose our common sense.
If they die then there is no evidence they ran a stop sign. Only that you were speeding because you have the black box that says so.

That is the definition of common sense......
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 12-09-2012, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by R/T FAN View Post
If they die then there is no evidence they ran a stop sign. Only that you were speeding because you have the black box that says so.
Using your example, either...

a) It was a 2-way stop such as a small street feeding into a main road, so the only way you would hit said person going 60mph is if they pulled out from the stop in front of you illegally or
b) It was a 4-way stop and you blew through the stop sign at 60mph or
c) You created a scenario that is impossible

Which is it?

That is the definition of common sense......
Your scenario and assumed outcome used anything but common sense. Speeding *does not* prove fault or guilt. The EDR data is used to reconstruct an accident as that is part of the job given to people reconstructing accident scenes.
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Old 12-09-2012, 06:46 PM
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Oh yes California. Someone (actually most of u guys) took the words outta my mouth. Someone said the other day that he saw common sense dragged out and was shot. Somewhere in those lines.
I carry a bottle of tylenol w me everyday The level of stress living here is harmful to your health ( not talking about the smog). It will cause a slow torturous premature death. Im dying to survive.
There was study done that I read somewhere that said humans are becoming less intelligent. And it's so so true here. I think we're the first ones to go back to the Stone Age in California. New York will follow. Lol


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Old 12-10-2012, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by HEMIZSP View Post
There was study done that I read somewhere that said humans are becoming less intelligent.
I see this first-hand everyday and even notice it in myself: we're decadent. Technology freed us from hard and dehumanizing labor and it was good for a while. Now we're reached the point where we surrender even our brain functions (like memory) to it so we can have more 'fun'. When AI emerges it may use us as lapdogs for a minute... ah, it won't - fun with pets is a concept you have to be alive to get. Now let's cram more software in our daily tools and appliances so they can take over more of what makes us human (like initiative, independence and freedom), shall we? Cars are one of the last refuges of individual freedom (especially something like a Challenger) and black boxes should've been kept out, but it's way too late. Funny thing about freedom: people don't really want it because it's scary not to be told what to do; that's why so many freak out when they retire. We're like those animals that won't leave the cage even when it's open, accepting contraptions like data recorders as safety devices or legal requirements. Big Brother can only be successful if it gives us what we want deep down.
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Old 12-10-2012, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Yahooligan View Post
EDRs aren't any more of a violation of privacy than red-light cameras. You are driving in PUBLIC streets, there is no expectation of privacy when it comes to your driving actions.

Nobody can just randomly stop you and connect to the EDR and read the data, that's not how the laws work nor is it how the EDRs work.

Beg to differ. There IS an expectation of privacy when snitch devices are place into PRIVATE property (my vehicle). Now if the ruling class wants to make my car payments, then that's another matter.
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Old 12-10-2012, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Yellow Jacket 2012 View Post
Many who voted have no clue of the dire consequences that will follow. You reap what you sow. One day the masses will understand. Your words could not be more true.
Lennin refered to them as "Useful Idiots". When someone is willing to relinquish their liberty for as little as a free cell phone (re: obamafone woman) and that type of person is in the voting majority then it's over. We should have changed the rules long ago. Originally in this country one could vote in federal elections if he was a land owner. Today it would fix many problems if one could vote only if he is a taxpayer. Those who don't pay for the ride should not have a say in where we go.

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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2012, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by pottedmeat20 View Post
Find it and remove it if your worried about it.
The last article I read on this subject stated that they rigged it so it is very difficult. Plus I'm betting that will be either illegal like veverything else is, or will give your insurance company an out on paying a claim.
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Old 12-10-2012, 09:04 AM
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I'd love to agree with you, mjb4450, but the Supreme Court has put a limit on the amount of privacy we can expect when in vehicles. That's how police can search your car for guns and contraband with much less restrictions than they can your house, and how traffic cams can take your your photo through the windshield. Vehicles are mobile and take us onto public and government property, unlike fixed residences, and although they are technically our private property (like our clothes and luggage), they are considered fair game. I find this revolting and a way around the 4th Amendment, but that's how the law has been set up. Give 'em an inch...

Otherwise I looked for laws against tampering with black boxes and couldn't find one. I think there's been no cases yet and they don't see a need. But if people start yanking the snitches out of their own cars, it won't take long for The Man to put a stop to it (and order retroactive install on older vehicles). Private interests are in bed with politicians who have legislators in their pockets. Once you're hip to how messed up that is you can't accept stuff like the black box as normal or innocuous without appearing dishonest or incredibly naive.
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Old 12-10-2012, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by mjb4450 View Post
The last article I read on this subject stated that they rigged it so it is very difficult. Plus I'm betting that will be either illegal like veverything else is, or will give your insurance company an out on paying a claim.
Absolutely. I used the key trick on my Charger and have ordered the No ESP kit for my Challenger, but I know that losing ABS along with the other nannies will get me fried in case of a major wreck. That's how they keep you in line (bundling). Technology is not supposed to be so complex, so proprietary, and so all-encompassing that you can't do a damn thing about your own property.
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