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Old 01-06-2013, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by CrazySRT8Guy View Post
I sure hope they do......my 2007 Avalanche did this. LOL.
I think this revelation solves the entire debate for me...and so I for one welcome our new robot overlords. Hahahaha


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Old 01-06-2013, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by KANGA5KHAN123 View Post
I think this revelation solves the entire debate for me...and so I for one welcome our new robot overlords. Hahahaha
This is the elephant in the room for me, that I only circled around instead of tackling head on because my position is already viewed as a reach (not that I'm not used to it, as I pride myself in going for the big picture... ).

I know you're joking, but... we are being replaced. Technology has matured to the point of doing many things better than us, like braking without lockup or putting HP on the ground without spin. Auto trannies, once seen as reserved for the lazy and the inept, are now shifting faster than manuals and embraced by racers. As we are fast approaching the Convergence (look it up), the student is getting to surpass the master. Beating us at chess was just a warm-up.
That is undeniable, as much as there are still battlegrounds here and there, like the arts fields (for now). But is it what we want? The title of the thread specifically mentioned 'dislike', after all.

Last night thinking about this thread I wondered how the techies would feel if their women came to be satisfied better than they ever could by machines (not to be crude, but maybe making it personal will drive it home - pun intended). Should they give up and surrender their husbandly duties to a technology 'superior' to anything biology can muster? Oh, wait, to quote Bill Burr, "I think we already accidentally did that!".

Well, guess what, I also enjoy braking, and accelerating, and feeling in control and empowered by a car, instead of driven by it. It's slowly and incrementally taken away, and you guys stating that computers 'do it better' are asking for it while manufacturers are happy to oblige (they, their commercial partners, and Big Brother all benefit from this).

Seriously, what I'm saying is that just because we can do it, it doesn't mean we should. We are led by the nose into a world of complete dependence. Besides the job losses already mentioned, and a few geniuses and artists that may always be needed, even as circus freaks, what kind of future are the majority of us looking at? I've read that some people think that 6 Billion+ people, unneeded for anything anymore, will just be plugged into a virtual life of constant entertainment, Matrix-style. Unless they can be put to use to power all the machines needed for that 'utopia', I don't see that happening. We are driving ourselves, one invention after another and apparently willingly, into obsolescence and subjugation.

So you say push button, I say tip of the iceberg. Now where's my tinfoil hat?!
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:19 AM
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I've been thinking these thoughts about the government's ability to track what we earn and how we spend.

The states are slowly ratching down on sales taxes, finding mutual agreements with each other to collect them.... pressuring Amazon and the credit card companies to share data. If you spend more than $600 on a service, you're supposed to hand a W-9 form and get the tax-id of that business, and report it on a 1099.

It's been true for along time that the Feds are informed of any banking transaction that you make over $10,000. They do this to spot undisclosed income, money laundering from drugs, etc. That's never been indexed for inflation (dollar devaluation). Given another 30 years at 4% devaluation, $10,000 in the future is like the purchasing power $3,086 today. Eventually, over time, basically every transaction you make will be open to inspection.

TSA, Homeland security, more cameras everywhere, RFID chips in merchandise. These layers keep building every decade.

I see these trends all converging someday. At what stage does the matrix know everything about you - the places you go, what you spend on, your credit and payment history, what you read online or at the library, all your health conditions, who you call or e-mail, etc.

I think people in the 1960s were probably more enthusiastic about the future. That was an era of space exploration, of cheap nucelar power, color television, home air conditioning. Technology brought us lots of goodies that we embraced.

There's more trepidation today, about where the future is leading.

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Old 01-06-2013, 09:22 AM
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I love it but wish it was cooler....like it should be back lit or something.
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Bosox Plum Crazy View Post
brisco - you aware the google is running driverless cars now in California? another huge negative impact of technology - the reduction of needed labor. yeah, today it is the post office getting strangled - but magazines, newspaper, eventually books - those industries employ a ton of folks. as tech become ever more all encompassing, you will lose employment positions. and, tech folks are some of the cheapest folks around - which is why apples are made in China and googel does not want to pay somebody to drive that car.
Yes, and that's another reason I'm glad I don't live in CA. We are heading toward a time when cars will drive themselves. My neighbor hates to drive, loves when we go out that my wife who doesn't drink is the designated driver for all of us. I hate being a passenger, and assumed most guys do, but my neighbor loves sitting in the back seat and being driven around. He would love to just get into a car in the morning and have it automatically drive him to work while he read or do work or what ever. Not me.

Technology can eliminate human resources (jobs), and it can be an adjustment for lots. I'm 50, and so many things that use to be done by humans aren't any more. Electronic tolls are slowly getting rid of toll takers, but I don't miss having to stop and pay a toll, just drive through with EZ-PASS. But there are jobs created for EZ-PASS, just less over all.

Slightly off topic, but discussed this the other day at work - consolidation of technology. A smart phone now replaces multiple devices; cameras, beepers/pagers, text devices, and of course, its your phone (which for some replaces their home phone). At 50, hard for me to believe that Polaroid and Kodak are no more. I mean, who buys hand held cameras any more?

And yes, it is sad that so many jobs are overseas that use to be here. I know this first hand as I've been "helping" my company move engineering jobs to India. I don't like it and don't agree, but my company has bought into the "software can be done anywhere" theory. Doesn't matter that quality has suffered, they just see how cheap it is to have so many engineers pounding away on computers instead of hiring in the US.

Okay, way off topic, time to check on the playoff games!!!
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Old 01-06-2013, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by BriscoCounty View Post
Technology can eliminate human resources (jobs), and it can be an adjustment for lots. I'm 50, and so many things that use to be done by humans aren't any more.

And yes, it is sad that so many jobs are overseas that use to be here. I know this first hand as I've been "helping" my company move engineering jobs to India. I don't like it and don't agree, but my company has bought into the "software can be done anywhere" theory. Doesn't matter that quality has suffered, they just see how cheap it is to have so many engineers pounding away on computers instead of hiring in the US.
I learned to program computers in the 1980s, thought technology was a secure future. I could not imagine it becoming commoditized.

I'm a called a business analyst now but it's just glorified formatting of files and data processing, in my opinion. Nothing glamorous about it. But I stick with the job since real software design has become a risky place to be. My employer has an IT group and I never look at the openings anymore. You could take a position and six months later your project is shut down for lack of funding, your team dispersed. I frankly don't want to spend my time trying to communicate/coordinate with people in India.

Just gimme this month's files... pound together... update this report... put a new header on it... ok whatever.

I save as much money as I can every paycheck. You never know when your job could become automated, or they buy a new system which obviates the need for the old reports.

"Fortunately" governmental red tape has given me more work the last few years. Somebody needs to be the data monkey to respond to regulator's questions.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:04 PM
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If it weren't for a prior post on this topic, I wouldn't have known these were push buttons. When I got my car it didn't have it installed, when I seen it I asked where it was and they said its and option...I didn't know any better, so I just went with it. Then I seen the post pop up and the guys said it was standard... So I emailed the dealership and they sent me one. Haven't put it on yet, cause she's in storage right now. My wifes car has a push button start and I like it. You don't need to try and find the key. Just keep it with you somewhere and push and go. Nice IMO
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Old 01-06-2013, 05:53 PM
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From reading this thread the only conclusion I can draw is that someday, when the machine overlord historians are looking back at the fall of humanity, the Challenger push-button start will be listed as the beginning of the new machine dominance era. Books will be written (in binary of course) detailing how this button was critical to the success of the transistors taking over the world.

All hail the button!


For myself - I will naively continue to enjoy the convenience of the button, and overlook the ominous future it brings with it. I like it.
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:25 AM
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More off-topic observations (sorry 'bout that)...


Originally Posted by swagled View Post
I've been thinking these thoughts about the government's ability to track what we earn and how we spend. [...] I see these trends all converging someday. At what stage does the matrix know everything about you - the places you go, what you spend on, your credit and payment history, what you read online or at the library, all your health conditions, who you call or e-mail, etc.
Thank you. I feel very alone whenever I even hint to this and the reactions I get range from "how do you know all this?" to "but I like my FaceBook!".

It's what I've called the Total Information Society. It's sold to us as a convenience and a way to be more connected when it actually places people in bubbles of self-involvement. You can't talk to anyone anymore and they can't be trusted behind the wheel either. Meanwhile, those who market this wonderful brave new world of instant connectedness with anybody and anything have a vested interest in reaching us. You can't have a functioning democracy when citizens are 100% monitored, either by corporations or government entities all working hand in hand.

Originally Posted by BriscoCounty View Post
Slightly off topic, but discussed this the other day at work - consolidation of technology. A smart phone now replaces multiple devices; cameras, beepers/pagers, text devices, and of course, its your phone (which for some replaces their home phone). At 50, hard for me to believe that Polaroid and Kodak are no more. I mean, who buys hand held cameras any more?
Great point. It's a lost battle, as I said, because the majority is asleep at the wheel and all too eager to embrace 'progress' and 'convenience', or to trade freedom for security. So they get what they ask for and so shall we, eventually. But for now I still practice systematic compartmentalization to resist the consolidation you brought up. Whenever possible and in doubt, I use manual controls instead of automatic ones and separate devices (or make them incompatible) to prevent them from working in concert. I avoid putting anything else than a computer online too. My dealer pre-installed LoJack on my car (and made me pay for it), for example, but I refuse to activate it.
But why? Because there is a reason why this is 'offered' and it's only in our interest on the surface. Either crappy, substandard equipment is bundled together to meet a price point at which marketing the product is viable (electronics, as in gremlin-laden cars) or the devices are set up to be used and controlled later. Did you know that any cell phone, on or not, can be turned into a recording device remotely? It requires a federal warrant at this point and as far as I know, but you don't have to be an international criminal to be creeped out. Similarly, if they even let you drive it, your car will one day be controllable by others, on top of spilling the beans to the whole goddamn world (via RFID) about its speed, location data, and probably inside video.


Originally Posted by mgnorth View Post
From reading this thread the only conclusion I can draw is that someday, when the machine overlord historians are looking back at the fall of humanity, the Challenger push-button start will be listed as the beginning of the new machine dominance era. Books will be written (in binary of course) detailing how this button was critical to the success of the transistors taking over the world.
It sure is easy to make it sound that way. I like to quote Freud saying that "sometimes a cigar is just a cigar", and maybe you're right that a push button is merely a convenient and cool new type of switch. I don't believe one word of that, of course, but one thing's for sure: push buttons won't put "transistors" in charge () - we will. This type of small 'progress', if you know what you're looking for, is like bigfoot's prints in the snow. Harmless in itself and isolated from what created it, but a signal all the same if you're paying attention instead of keeping your nose in the air.
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:44 AM
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I like the push button start.

Removing the button as stated, and using the FOB is nice too, but when I do that, I end up utilizing the "key trick"..............."Holy Crap" LOL
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