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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 12:02 PM Thread Starter
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Question Is it True that Challengers...

... are considered American Muscle Cars...

... built in Canada...

... with a German Automatic Transmission...

... on a German Mercedes Chassis...

... with a dashboard full of Asian electronics...

... financed by Global Bankers...

... and Owned by an Italian Company?

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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 12:20 PM
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the Gen 3 & Gen 4 F-body (Camaro / Firebird) were built at Canadian plants as well during the 80s - 90s.

after the changes that GM and Ford are going to - their market share will shrink and don't be surprised that mergers happen with other companies.

Ford going to only cross overs, trucks and Mustang only in their lineup is going to cut a lot of sales out

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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 12:22 PM
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Dodge was founded in 1900 by the Dodge brothers and is currently headquartered in Auburn Hills, Michigan. It has been an American company since it was founded 118 years ago.

Although the parent company of Dodge is FCA (Fiat Chrysler Automobiles,) and Fiat is the primary owner, that does not mean Dodge automatically becomes an Italian corporation.

Years ago, Ford Motor Company bought Jaguar. That did not mean that Jaguar at that time stopped being an English car or even an English company. It just meant that a larger corporation had acquired a controlling interest.

Currently, BMW owns Rolls Royce and Mini. That does not mean that Rolls Royce and Mini are German companies now. The products are still manufactured in England, with full staff in England to manage and operate those divisions.

In today’s worldwide financial marketplace, it’s common for corporations to purchase controlling interests in various companies all over the world. That doesn’t diminish the operations or heritage of those companies…

Retrieved from: https://www.quora.com/Why-is-Dodge-a...-owned-by-Fiat
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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 12:33 PM
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Don't forget

.....on a German Mercedes E-Class Chassis

.... with a German Mercedes Automatic Transmission

.....with a dashboard full of crap Asian electronics!

Not really accurate to call it "American Made" but still can call it an "American Muscle Car"....because, just like this country, it's a melting pot of all the best and worst that the rest of the world has to offer.

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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 01:02 PM Thread Starter
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Don't forget

.....on a German Mercedes E-Class Chassis

.... with a German Mercedes Automatic Transmission

.....with a dashboard full of crap Asian electronics!

Not really accurate to call it "American Made" but still can call it an "American Muscle Car"....because, just like this country, it's a melting pot of all the best and worst that the rest of the world has to offer.

Wow, didn't realize the Trans is from a German company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_8HP_transmission

Chrysler Group LLC initially received the 8HP 8-speed automatic transmissions from the ZF plant in Saarbrucken, Germany.

By 2013, in parallel with Chrysler Group, ZF had set up a new transmission production plant in Gray Court, South Carolina.[7] ZF Friedrichshafen and Chrysler Group have reached a supply and license agreement for the 8HP. Chrysler Group is licensed to produce the 8HP at the company’s Kokomo Transmission Plant and the Kokomo Casting plant, production began in 2013.

Due to changes in internal design, the shift times have reduced to 200 milliseconds;

I've only heard positive reviews on this transmission. Every Youtube car guru loves it.

Now about that so-called Mercedes E-Class chassis, is that true???

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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 01:15 PM
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I don’t care about the corporate alignment. All that matters to me is that the R/T models are rear-wheel drive and have a pushrod V8. Low-rpm torque!

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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSpoiler View Post
Wow, didn't realize the Trans is from a German company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_8HP_transmission

Chrysler Group LLC initially received the 8HP 8-speed automatic transmissions from the ZF plant in Saarbrucken, Germany.

By 2013, in parallel with Chrysler Group, ZF had set up a new transmission production plant in Gray Court, South Carolina.[7] ZF Friedrichshafen and Chrysler Group have reached a supply and license agreement for the 8HP. Chrysler Group is licensed to produce the 8HP at the company’s Kokomo Transmission Plant and the Kokomo Casting plant, production began in 2013.

Due to changes in internal design, the shift times have reduced to 200 milliseconds;

I've only heard positive reviews on this transmission. Every Youtube car guru loves it.

Now about that so-called Mercedes E-Class chassis, is that true???
Yes the platform was adapted from E-Class chassis (W210 & W211 elements) and some S-class elements - modified for Chrysler's specs.

At the time, there wasn't any RWD platform passenger cars in the line up. So the Daimler platform was shared as a development starting point.
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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSpoiler View Post
Wow, didn't realize the Trans is from a German company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_8HP_transmission

Chrysler Group LLC initially received the 8HP 8-speed automatic transmissions from the ZF plant in Saarbrucken, Germany.

By 2013, in parallel with Chrysler Group, ZF had set up a new transmission production plant in Gray Court, South Carolina.[7] ZF Friedrichshafen and Chrysler Group have reached a supply and license agreement for the 8HP. Chrysler Group is licensed to produce the 8HP at the company’s Kokomo Transmission Plant and the Kokomo Casting plant, production began in 2013.

Due to changes in internal design, the shift times have reduced to 200 milliseconds;

I've only heard positive reviews on this transmission. Every Youtube car guru loves it.

Now about that so-called Mercedes E-Class chassis, is that true???
Here's some info on the chassis.

https://www.adandp.media/articles/engineering-the-lx

The information about all the different nations of origin isn't an indictment of the quality of each of those contributing factors, just a commentary on whether it should be considered and "American" Muscle car or not.

Jury is still out on that.

Undeniable that the enthusiasts of the model (and platform) love it. I loved my Challenger and will be going back to the LX platform for my next car (hopefully, an AWD Dodge Sedan). Doesn't matter to me where it's made or who owns the company. I'd prefer some better electronics, but seems only those in far-away lands are capable of producing the buggy crap in the LX cars.
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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSpoiler View Post
... are considered American Muscle Cars...

... built in Canada...

... with a German Automatic Transmission...

... financed by Global Bankers...

... and Owned by an Italian Company?
By definition you have a solid point, unless there are Americans doing the actual assembly.

Muscle car is an American term used to refer to a variety of high-performance automobiles. The Merriam-Webster dictionary defines muscle cars as "any of a group of American-made 2-door mid size cars with powerful engines designed for high-performance driving."

Sorry Charger lovers. Four doors ain't cutting it! All American Muscle Sedan


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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 02:36 PM
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Well, glad I have a 6-speed... LOL

It makes no matter to me. This is a global economy and Fiat is a public company so the owners are spread all over the world just like all the other car companies that sell common stock. Buy some Fiat FCAU stock if that will make you feel any better....

Here are the top Institutional owners and number of shares:

1. BAILLIE GIFFORD & CO 72,408,480
2. TIGER GLOBAL MANAGEMENT LLC 62,170,000
3. HARRIS ASSOCIATES L P 58,213,810
4. VANGUARD GROUP INC 31,221,379
5. RUANE, CUNNIFF & GOLDFARB L.P. 24,545,223

Chances are if you have any mutual funds or 401K investments you are part of that ownership group.


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