1st Oil Change - Page 6 - Dodge Challenger Forum: Challenger & SRT8 Forums
General Maintenance Discussion This sub-forum is for the discussion of general maintenance of your Challenger such as oil changes, coolant maintenance, brake pad replacement, differential fluid changes, alignments, air filters and everything else to maintain your ride.

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post #51 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-26-2019, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by 19johned53 View Post
Great. Seeing how you stated that you don't want to waste your time on this subject, have you contacted FCA to see what they say about using Amzoil and if it acceptably meets the FCA specs?



That is a very good question.
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post #52 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-26-2019, 07:12 PM
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That is a very good question.
I think I know what FCA's answer would be. And that's without relying on a crystal ball.

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post #53 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 04:25 AM
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[B]
When AMSOIL makes an oil recommendation for a certain specification, it is based on our Product Specialists confirming that we meet all the requirements. This confirmation is based on the results of lab test results, consultation with our technology suppliers, and through Chrysler themselves and their published technical requirements for this specification.
One other question I have for all of you........do any of you have a copy of the FCA memo/edict stating that you HAVE to use Pennzoil 0W-40 oil in the SRT cars with 6.4L engines to comply with their warranty? I'd really like to see it.
If FCA comments, I hope their response is a little less fuzzy than the comment from Amsoil.

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post #54 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 07:08 AM
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Speaking about fuzzy, the owners manual only says the manufacturer recommends:

Quote:
For best performance and maximum protection under all
types of operating conditions, the manufacturer only
recommends engine oils that are API Certified and meet
the requirements of FCA US Material Standard MS-6395
Quote:
MOPAR SAE 5W-20 engine oil approved to FCA US
Material Standard MS-6395 such as Pennzoil, Shell Helix
or equivalent is recommended for all operating tempera-
tures. This engine oil improves low temperature starting
and vehicle fuel economy.
It never says you MUST use this oil. Is there something, somewhere that says you must use this, and not just recommended? We all talk about voiding warranty if we don't use an approved oil, but if it's only recommended, then wouldn't it come down to not doing required oil change intervals, not using the correct viscosity, and/or not keeping the engine lubricated IE: not enough oil?

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post #55 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Guy View Post
Speaking about fuzzy, the owners manual only says the manufacturer recommends:





It never says you MUST use this oil. Is there something, somewhere that says you must use this, and not just recommended? We all talk about voiding warranty if we don't use an approved oil, but if it's only recommended, then wouldn't it come down to not doing required oil change intervals, not using the correct viscosity, and/or not keeping the engine lubricated IE: not enough oil?

A Guy
There is certainly merit to what you are saying. But why provide the manufacturer with an avenue to escape or evade responsibility for an engine related warranty issue? I've always used Mobil 1 in my Vettes because they recommend it and it's good oil. I'm using Penzoil that meets their specs in the Challenger to avoid any warranty issues. Besides, it's pretty good oil anyway.
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post #56 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Guy View Post
Speaking about fuzzy, the owners manual only says the manufacturer recommends:





It never says you MUST use this oil. Is there something, somewhere that says you must use this, and not just recommended? We all talk about voiding warranty if we don't use an approved oil, but if it's only recommended, then wouldn't it come down to not doing required oil change intervals, not using the correct viscosity, and/or not keeping the engine lubricated IE: not enough oil?

A Guy

Recommended: Advised or suggested as good or suitable.


Which implies oils not recommended are not good or suitable and it is not advised they be used.


The problem with straying from a recommended oil is this opens to the door to using just anything.


In the case of the Hellcat with the 0w-40 viscosity "recommended" with other cars for which the automaker also recommends a 0w-40 oil (albeit some 5w-40 and even one 5w-50 oil are also recommended provided ambient temperatures are not too low), some owners decided if 5w-40 ok then 10w-40 even better. Or if 5w-50 ok what's the harm in 15w-50? Or even 20w-50 or even 10w-60?


And a few decided that 0w-40 was too "thick", so 0w-30 or 10w-30 was "better".


A few decided to blend their own oil and combined two different oils in some ratio to come up with 7.39w-38.5 oil or some such silliness.
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post #57 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 08:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Guy View Post
Speaking about fuzzy, the owners manual only says the manufacturer recommends:

It never says you MUST use this oil. Is there something, somewhere that says you must use this, and not just recommended? We all talk about voiding warranty if we don't use an approved oil, but if it's only recommended, then wouldn't it come down to not doing required oil change intervals, not using the correct viscosity, and/or not keeping the engine lubricated IE: not enough oil?

A Guy
It may only be a "recommended oil", but since it's clearly spelled out that using anything but the recommended oil will void the warranty...

It's simply the kinder, gentler FCA way of saying "You must, or else". And it works on me, as I dislike being told that I must do something.
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post #58 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 08:41 AM
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Here's paste from Amsoil's warranty:


WHAT THIS LIMITED WARRANTY DOES NOT COVER:


• AMSOIL lubricants for which AMSOIL offers a separate, specific warranty.


• AMSOIL lubricants that are not (1) packaged by AMSOIL or an authorized AMSOIL packager, and (2) sold by AMSOIL or an authorized AMSOIL Dealer.


• AMSOIL lubricants that have been used in conjunction with any other product or additive that has not been authorized for use by AMSOIL.


• AMSOIL lubricants contaminated after leaving the AMSOIL facilities or premises. Examples include contamination due to improper handling, re-packaging, storage or filtration and contamination from dirty dispensing equipment.


• AMSOIL lubricants used in mechanically deficient equipment. Examples of mechanically deficient equipment include flawed or defective equipment due to abnormal operation, negligence, abuse, previous damage or improper modification, including use of components other than those from AMSOIL or AMSOIL aftermarket partners.


• Failure of equipment due to not following original equipment manufacturer (hereinafter, “OEM”) recommendations for warranty coverage, including lubricants, maintenance and drain intervals, prior to the first installation of AMSOIL lubricants, or any other pre-existing condition or OEM defect unrelated to the use of AMSOIL.


• Repair or replacement of equipment because of normal wear.


• Failure of equipment when AMSOIL lubricants are not used in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage. The Consumer is solely responsible for determining a product’s merchantability or fitness (“suitability”) for a particular purpose and assumes all risks and liabilities when used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage.


• AMSOIL lubricants used in any manned aircraft or aviation application.


• AMSOIL lubricants that have been used for the purposes of racing.


• Any allegedly defective AMSOIL lubricant for which a reasonable sample has not been preserved.


• Damages if the Consumer does not send or make the parts requested available for inspection by AMSOIL or its insurer.
-----------------------------


I like this one:

• Failure of equipment when AMSOIL lubricants are not used in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage. The Consumer is solely responsible for determining a product’s merchantability or fitness (“suitability”) for a particular purpose and assumes all risks and liabilities when used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage.



Note "recommendations" is used. And this bears repeating: The consumer is solely responsible for determining a product's merchantability or fitness ("suitability") for a particular purpose and assumes *all* risks and liabilities when used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage.




Notice how "recommendations" are sprinkled about?


Last but not least, there's this: "...used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage."


"strict accordance" with either the written "recommendations" of AMSOIL or the *OEM" for warranty coverage".



Like I said what that Amsoil rep had to say is only worth the paper it was written on.


Here's a link to the document:


https://www.amsoil.com/warranty.aspx





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post #59 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Guy View Post
Speaking about fuzzy, the owners manual only says the manufacturer recommends:





It never says you MUST use this oil. Is there something, somewhere that says you must use this, and not just recommended? We all talk about voiding warranty if we don't use an approved oil, but if it's only recommended, then wouldn't it come down to not doing required oil change intervals, not using the correct viscosity, and/or not keeping the engine lubricated IE: not enough oil?

A Guy
Per the warranty book:

"Maintenance Costs Not Covered

Your warranties don’t cover the costs of repairing damage caused by poor or improper maintenance. Nor do they cover damage caused by the use of contaminate by the use of fuels, oils, lubricants, cleaners or fluids other than those recommended in your Owners Manual."

Also - I think it's important to note that you don't have to use a particular brand of oil - so you don't have to use Pennzoil in the 6.4, but you *do* have to use an oil that meets FCA's MS spec - whatever brand that may be. The problem here is that Amsoil doesn't appear to officially meet that spec.

Last edited by jtrosky; 04-27-2019 at 08:46 AM.
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post #60 of 161 (permalink) Old 04-27-2019, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockster View Post
Here's paste from Amsoil's warranty:


WHAT THIS LIMITED WARRANTY DOES NOT COVER:


• AMSOIL lubricants for which AMSOIL offers a separate, specific warranty.


• AMSOIL lubricants that are not (1) packaged by AMSOIL or an authorized AMSOIL packager, and (2) sold by AMSOIL or an authorized AMSOIL Dealer.


• AMSOIL lubricants that have been used in conjunction with any other product or additive that has not been authorized for use by AMSOIL.


• AMSOIL lubricants contaminated after leaving the AMSOIL facilities or premises. Examples include contamination due to improper handling, re-packaging, storage or filtration and contamination from dirty dispensing equipment.


• AMSOIL lubricants used in mechanically deficient equipment. Examples of mechanically deficient equipment include flawed or defective equipment due to abnormal operation, negligence, abuse, previous damage or improper modification, including use of components other than those from AMSOIL or AMSOIL aftermarket partners.


• Failure of equipment due to not following original equipment manufacturer (hereinafter, “OEM”) recommendations for warranty coverage, including lubricants, maintenance and drain intervals, prior to the first installation of AMSOIL lubricants, or any other pre-existing condition or OEM defect unrelated to the use of AMSOIL.


• Repair or replacement of equipment because of normal wear.


• Failure of equipment when AMSOIL lubricants are not used in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage. The Consumer is solely responsible for determining a product’s merchantability or fitness (“suitability”) for a particular purpose and assumes all risks and liabilities when used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage.


• AMSOIL lubricants used in any manned aircraft or aviation application.


• AMSOIL lubricants that have been used for the purposes of racing.


• Any allegedly defective AMSOIL lubricant for which a reasonable sample has not been preserved.


• Damages if the Consumer does not send or make the parts requested available for inspection by AMSOIL or its insurer.
-----------------------------


I like this one:

• Failure of equipment when AMSOIL lubricants are not used in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage. The Consumer is solely responsible for determining a product’s merchantability or fitness (“suitability”) for a particular purpose and assumes all risks and liabilities when used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage.



Note "recommendations" is used. And this bears repeating: The consumer is solely responsible for determining a product's merchantability or fitness ("suitability") for a particular purpose and assumes *all* risks and liabilities when used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage.




Notice how "recommendations" are sprinkled about?


Last but not least, there's this: "...used other than in strict accordance with either the written recommendations of AMSOIL or the OEM for warranty coverage."


"strict accordance" with either the written "recommendations" of AMSOIL or the *OEM" for warranty coverage".



Like I said what that Amsoil rep had to say is only worth the paper it was written on.


Here's a link to the document:


https://www.amsoil.com/warranty.aspx




That's a whole lot of "peace of mind" for $13+ per quart.
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Last edited by 19johned53; 04-27-2019 at 10:55 AM.
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