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Hello,

I have a '09 Challenger SE with the 3.5L V6 engine. Engine has 125k miles on it. Was thinking about using Mobil 1 10W-30 High Mileage Full Synthetic Motor Oil, but I'm not sure if previous owner was using conventional oil. Please let me know your recommendations. Thanks in advance!
 

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It shouldn't matter switching to synthetic if that turns out to be the case. It could be an issue for -1990 or so cars, but yours is only 10 years old. I think I'd go through at least one oil change at normal interval before considering going to extended intervals though

A Guy
 

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Hello,

I have a '09 Challenger SE with the 3.5L V6 engine. Engine has 125k miles on it. Was thinking about using Mobil 1 10W-30 High Mileage Full Synthetic Motor Oil, but I'm not sure if previous owner was using conventional oil. Please let me know your recommendations. Thanks in advance!
Just what does a high mileage oil bring to the table?

10W-30... Ok so its low temperature viscosity is 10W. (The 'W' represents a temperature of 32F.) That suggests there is some concern for the engine clearances being so great that a 0w oil even a 5w oil is not suitable for use in the engine for fear they would not provide sufficient lubrication even when the engine was cold.

But the high temperature (measured at 212F) viscosity is 30. One would think if the engine was so worn as to need 10W when cold it would need something more than 30 when hot.

I have driven a few cars to 150K miles and beyond and one to 317K miles. The same oil that was used when the engine was new worked just fine when the engine had all those miles on it. For a number of the cars I drove to 150K miles and beyond the oil, recommended oil, was Mobil 1 0w-40. For my last two cars, a Porsche Boxster and a Porsche Turbo, because of the high ambient temperatures here and the congestion I sometimes found myself in, I switched both engines over to Mobil 1 5w-50 oil. This was an approved oil as long as the temperature was above -25C.

I had no way easy way of knowing the oil temperature of those cars but with my Hellcat under the same operating conditions the oil temperature can climb to 230F.

However, I drove both cars a good number of miles on 0w-40 oil and in 116F to 119F ambient temperatures with neither engine suffering any.

The switch to 5w-50 was mainly for me, my "peace of mind". But it was an approved oil. And low temperatures here are not a problem.

The engine has 125K miles on it. If it is running ok then you should probably continue to do what the previous owner was doing.

If you don't know what oil the previous owner was using and can't find this out, my advice is to use the oil the factory recommends. At least change it per factory schedule if not more often.

Leave the high mileage oil on the (high) shelf.
 

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I used straight 10w-30 on my 2010 Challenger 3.5L V6 from the day I bought it off the lot new to the day I sold it six months ago with over 340,000 miles on it. I just changed the oil every 3000 miles religiously. That was it. Make sure you change out the rocker arms if they haven't been done already.

Greg
 

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As long as your geographical location does not preclude using a 10w oil, 10w-30 is the best choice for that 3.5L. They are prone to sludging, and running a 0w or 5w oil will sludge even worse.

If the morning temps where you are get down to freezing for days at a time, startup oil circulation with a 10w can be dicey, but using a synthetic 10w will mitigate that somewhat if you need to.

Speaking of sludging on the 3.5L, running a catch can on that engine can be a good thing. The intake plenum is a dual runner design that uses an electronically activated set of butterfly valves to switch between runners (at 5K RPM), and those valves can get gunked up over time from crap coming through the PCV line, causing the device actuating the valves to malfunction and throw a P1004 code (and corresponding Check Engine Light).

The best way to prevent, or at least slow down, the gunking up of those valves is to reduce the amount of oily crap coming into the intake plenum via the PCV valve, which is precisely what the Catch Can was made to do.

There are pages and pages of debates about the efficacy of catch cans, and I’m in firm agreement that they aren’t necessary on all engines. However, they are vital to the longevity of some engines, and the venerable Dodge 3.5L is one of those engines.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Just what does a high mileage oil bring to the table?

10W-30... Ok so its low temperature viscosity is 10W. (The 'W' represents a temperature of 32F.) That suggests there is some concern for the engine clearances being so great that a 0w oil even a 5w oil is not suitable for use in the engine for fear they would not provide sufficient lubrication even when the engine was cold.

But the high temperature (measured at 212F) viscosity is 30. One would think if the engine was so worn as to need 10W when cold it would need something more than 30 when hot.

I have driven a few cars to 150K miles and beyond and one to 317K miles. The same oil that was used when the engine was new worked just fine when the engine had all those miles on it. For a number of the cars I drove to 150K miles and beyond the oil, recommended oil, was Mobil 1 0w-40. For my last two cars, a Porsche Boxster and a Porsche Turbo, because of the high ambient temperatures here and the congestion I sometimes found myself in, I switched both engines over to Mobil 1 5w-50 oil. This was an approved oil as long as the temperature was above -25C.

I had no way easy way of knowing the oil temperature of those cars but with my Hellcat under the same operating conditions the oil temperature can climb to 230F.

However, I drove both cars a good number of miles on 0w-40 oil and in 116F to 119F ambient temperatures with neither engine suffering any.

The switch to 5w-50 was mainly for me, my "peace of mind". But it was an approved oil. And low temperatures here are not a problem.

The engine has 125K miles on it. If it is running ok then you should probably continue to do what the previous owner was doing.

If you don't know what oil the previous owner was using and can't find this out, my advice is to use the oil the factory recommends. At least change it per factory schedule if not more often.

Leave the high mileage oil on the (high) shelf.


Thanks for the info, Rockster! Makes a lot of sense.
 

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I used straight 10w-30 on my 2010 Challenger 3.5L V6 from the day I bought it off the lot new to the day I sold it six months ago with over 340,000 miles on it. I just changed the oil every 3000 miles religiously. That was it. Make sure you change out the rocker arms if they haven't been done already.

Greg

Thanks for the info, Greg!

Can't believe you got 340k out of this engine! I heard most people can't get them past 200k. Can I ask what brand 10w30 you were using?

Also, I'll definitely get the rocker arms replaced. Where did you buy yours? The ones I'm seeing online are almost 4x the price of the newer model rocker arms. Not sure why.
 

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As long as your geographical location does not preclude using a 10w oil, 10w-30 is the best choice for that 3.5L. They are prone to sludging, and running a 0w or 5w oil will sludge even worse.

If the morning temps where you are get down to freezing for days at a time, startup oil circulation with a 10w can be dicey, but using a synthetic 10w will mitigate that somewhat if you need to.

Speaking of sludging on the 3.5L, running a catch can on that engine can be a good thing. The intake plenum is a dual runner design that uses an electronically activated set of butterfly valves to switch between runners (at 5K RPM), and those valves can get gunked up over time from crap coming through the PCV line, causing the device actuating the valves to malfunction and throw a P1004 code (and corresponding Check Engine Light).

The best way to prevent, or at least slow down, the gunking up of those valves is to reduce the amount of oily crap coming into the intake plenum via the PCV valve, which is precisely what the Catch Can was made to do.

There are pages and pages of debates about the efficacy of catch cans, and I’m in firm agreement that they aren’t necessary on all engines. However, they are vital to the longevity of some engines, and the venerable Dodge 3.5L is one of those engines.

Thanks Nuke! I just spent 30min looking for a catch can for the 3.5L V6, but I'm not sure if they still make em. Any leads on a good website?
 

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If you are not in a hurry ;)


You can also make a universal catch can work with the right bracket

A Guy
 

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Fail to understand how a 10w-30 oil is less prone to sludge formation than either a 5w-30 or a 0w-30 oil. At cold start both the 5w-30 and 0w-30 oils should circulate better than a 10w-30 oil provided of course all the oils have the same detergent package.

Then hot all 3 oils should circulate equally well all having a high temperature viscosity index of 30.
 

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Thanks Nuke! I just spent 30min looking for a catch can for the 3.5L V6, but I'm not sure if they still make em. Any leads on a good website?
I haven’t ever seen one made for it specifically, but you can run a universal one like linked above. Mounting the thing somewhere that’s accessible and out of the way at the same time is the hard part.

When I had mine, I used one of those inline air filters for pneumatic tools as a CC, and I had it mounted up under the cowl behind the intake. Not a very accessible place, but I never got motivated enough to move it.

There is a bracket on the inside of the right fender just next to the fuse box that’s the best spot for mounting a CC on those engines I think. But you’ll have to come up with your own bracket to do it.
 

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Hello,

I have a '09 Challenger SE with the 3.5L V6 engine. Engine has 125k miles on it. Was thinking about using Mobil 1 10W-30 High Mileage Full Synthetic Motor Oil, but I'm not sure if previous owner was using conventional oil. Please let me know your recommendations. Thanks in advance!
What Rockster said! I'd also consider a full synthetic oil, catch can, and use what the Owner's Manual recommends for oil viscosity.
 

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Fail to understand how a 10w-30 oil is less prone to sludge formation than either a 5w-30 or a 0w-30 oil. At cold start both the 5w-30 and 0w-30 oils should circulate better than a 10w-30 oil provided of course all the oils have the same detergent package.

Then hot all 3 oils should circulate equally well all having a high temperature viscosity index of 30.
The magic (VIIs?) that allows an oil to go from 0w/5w to 20/30 weight tends to evaporate, for lack of a better word, over time and miles and end up as sludge in the 3.5L, in both the engine’s insides and its plenum.

I don’t know the specifics about why that engine is harder on the oil like it is, but the end result is that the less VIIs an oil has, the less there is to evaporate and end up as sludge. More specifically, choosing the engine oil with the lowest NOACK value will yield the best results as far as reducing an oil’s sludge potential in the 3.5L.

Over time, I found out that an easier way to judge a potential oil to use on my 3.5L, instead of trying to remember all that, was to go with the oil that had the least amount of distance between its cold weight and its op temp weight.

So in a choice between a 10w-30 and a 5w-30, I would choose the 10w-30 since it had fewer VIIs and thus less propensity to sludge up the engine.

For a 0w-20 vs 10w-30 choice, I still went with the 10w-30 even though they both appear to have the same amount of VIIs, but that’s mostly because my 3.5L just did not seem to like any 0w I ever tried. They caused typewriter startups after only 30 min of sitting, and if left sitting overnight, the startup noises were horrendous.

Those 3.5L engines are some strange beasts. Out of the 3 Dodge engines I’ve run CCs on so far, the 3.5L would fill its CC up the quickest, if using the right (wrong?) oil, and it’s not even close.

By zeroing I’m on an oil mine liked (Valvoline HM 10w-30 IIRC), I was able to reduce the rate at which it would fill up the CC, but even then it was only down to about as fast my Hemi now does.

Don’t even get me started on the horror show that was the cleaning of the inside of the intake plenum when I did the car’s first spark plug change at 75K miles. The gooey black mess that I washed out of that plenum with the aid of 3 cans of carb cleaning spray was beyond nasty. No surprise that I had the P1004 code stored on my PCM when I did it too, though it was not active at that time.
 

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What Rockster said! I'd also consider a full synthetic oil, catch can, and use what the Owner's Manual recommends for oil viscosity.
FWIW the owners manual in my 2010 specified 10w-30. I had to switch to 5w-30 for the OCI that spans what we call winter here, but 10w-30 was run the other 11.5 months of the year.
 

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Thanks for the info, Greg!

Can't believe you got 340k out of this engine! I heard most people can't get them past 200k. Can I ask what brand 10w30 you were using?

Also, I'll definitely get the rocker arms replaced. Where did you buy yours? The ones I'm seeing online are almost 4x the price of the newer model rocker arms. Not sure why.

All I ever ran was 10w-30. First Valvoline then Mobile. The place I'd get my oil changed has a car wash so I got a free wash with the oil change every 3-4 weeks (I do a LOT of driving). When I pulled the rocker covers there was ZERO sludge evident. Never used a catch can. Never needed one. Summer and winter in New England, it never missed a beat. Only sold the car because a rocker arm ate up the camshaft on the passengers side. Got a Charger now.

Greg
 

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I ran across this link I had bookmarked from a long time back. It's got a few useful nuggets of information on the 3.5L and keeping it running as long as possible:
 
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