Dodge Challenger Forum banner
  • Hey everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part of October's Ride of the Month Challenge!
1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
136 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm looking to get some better cooling for the car, since here in the summer in Dubai the temperature varies between 110 to 120 degrees F and the humidity is ridiculous as well... I was thinking of removing my 180 thermostat and getting me a 160, but people here in the forum seem to think its pointless :S can some1 please explain why? I was also thinking of maybe changing the radiator or the fans to improve the cooling of the car since its really dragging down the performance. Does anyone have any recommendations on what brands or what parts to change to improve my cooling.

I'm running a LC Kennebell btw..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
323 Posts
I'm looking to get some better cooling for the car, since here in the summer in Dubai the temperature varies between 110 to 120 degrees F and the humidity is ridiculous as well... I was thinking of removing my 180 thermostat and getting me a 160, but people here in the forum seem to think its pointless :S can some1 please explain why? I was also thinking of maybe changing the radiator or the fans to improve the cooling of the car since its really dragging down the performance. Does anyone have any recommendations on what brands or what parts to change to improve my cooling.

I'm running a LC Kennebell btw..

You don't list a DSP in your list. If you use a 180'F TStat you need to drop all the fan temps 20'F as well.

You can in addition to this have a custom radiator built by someone like Ron Davis Racing to give you more cooling capacity. Since you are boosting the engine it's probably beyond the capacity of the stock radiator with your ambient conditions.

You say you have a liquid cooled KB, that restricts airflow through the radiator which makes it less efficient for sure and dumps all that heat in there as well.

We don't get nearly that hot in FL but it does get close to 100'F, the humidity is off the scale and I have zero cooling issues 2009 SRT8 6spd NA. 180'F TStat and DSP CMR tune.

--CC
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
136 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I was recommended the liquid cooled KB when I got it from mrnorms, they recommended this set up for the weather that we have over here :S... I already have a custom tune with the fans set to lower temps... so I guess it wouldn't really make a difference to install the 160 tstat and reprogram the fans?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,634 Posts
What did Mr. Norms recommend for your cooling issues?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
867 Posts
What are your engine temps now? I have the same set-up as you and the cooling system handles the heat pretty well in the 115 degree heat. I will run the heater when i"m beating the hell out of the car and its 100 plus degrees, it does help. All the thermostat does is modulate the flow of coolant. It opens and closes to maintain the rated setting of the thermostat. Once its fully open your at capacity of the cooling system. By adding a lower thermostat it will open sooner. If your running a 170 now and your jacket temps are 190 the thermostat is fully open. If you change it to 160 you will still be at 190 and your temps will float depending on load on engine because the thermostat is fully open and not modulating.

Having the LC is a nominal decrease in engine cooling capacity. The big penalty is the intercooler for the SC in front of the radiator impedes air flow and reduces cooling capacity. I always look at my IAT, if I'm below the 195 engine temp and my IAT are below 145 I don't sweat it.

Stack Performance has a upgraded aluminum radiator that increasing cooling capacity for those hard core guys. I pasted a link below.

SP Aluminum Radiator for 6.1L Challenger, Charger, Magnum, 300
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
428 Posts
Larger radiator is about all you can do. Volume will be your friend. Think about an oil cooler in those environments as well. You may actually stay cooler by putting in a hotter thermostat. The water will spend more time in the radiator and have more chance to cool down before being recycled into the engine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,683 Posts
For these sort of situations, has anyone ever considered additional fans mounted "somewhere" that could actively draw hot engine air out of the engine bay? The rationale behind this is that with all the radiator exhaust, early thermostat triggering, and the fan blowing activity to aggressively cool the coolant, it only serves to put that heat in the engine bay to bake everything around the engine, including through all of the plastic ducts of your induction paths (like a big forced-convection oven, if you think about it). That will only work against you as it pushes your IAT reading even higher.

Naturally, it isn't good enough to just draw out hot engine bay air. This is where you augment the effect with additional vents/duct openings in the hood (or piped in from the front fascia, somewhere) that will discretely vent ambient air upon areas you specifically want to keep cool(-er), i.e., plastic induction tubing, airbox, external surfaces of the SC? The idea is, if you had the choice, you would rather bathe these components in hot ambient air, than hot engine bay air. The latter is far hotter and more lasting, I would think...even if you do live in Dubai. ;)

If you're really slick, you re-route the low pressure line of the A/C (the cool-to-the-touch aluminum line) so that it actually passes through the airbox or intake pipe with a few wide coils, to serve as a weak active-CAI effect, while you do run the A/C. It certainly won't keep up with WOT, but it will allow cool air to accumulate all of the other times you aren't WOT. That's like a free-lunch for the taking, as a side-perk of enjoying cool A/C. At the very least, it will bias your intake air a few degrees downward, which is always useful compared to the temperature rise from heat that soaks through the stock setup. The engine and engine controls will also yield a more vigorous leap off the line if it is starting off with a nice plug of cool air sitting in the intake, instead of a hot plug of air.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
491 Posts
I've heard that the 160 tsat should only be utilized if your running a supercharger period. Tne 180 degree tstat should be fine for your use, that's what I'm currently using. I live in Houston, TX & our weather is very similar to yours & I have no over heating issues to speak of. . Not sure if I can to what all's been suggested but I used to use a product called "Water Wetter" in the radiator of my 87 Buick Grand national that I used to own. I would use that product in conjunction with "distilled water" in my after market 5 core radiator. The water wetter would help lower the temperature of the water going into my radiator. If memory serves all of that would help keep my turbocharged-intercooled engine running cooler. Its been a while but I'm not sure if they still make "Water Wetter" any more but I'd give it a shot if it is.
Hope this helps!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
136 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
What are your engine temps now? I have the same set-up as you and the cooling system handles the heat pretty well in the 115 degree heat. I will run the heater when i"m beating the hell out of the car and its 100 plus degrees, it does help. All the thermostat does is modulate the flow of coolant. It opens and closes to maintain the rated setting of the thermostat. Once its fully open your at capacity of the cooling system. By adding a lower thermostat it will open sooner. If your running a 170 now and your jacket temps are 190 the thermostat is fully open. If you change it to 160 you will still be at 190 and your temps will float depending on load on engine because the thermostat is fully open and not modulating.

Having the LC is a nominal decrease in engine cooling capacity. The big penalty is the intercooler for the SC in front of the radiator impedes air flow and reduces cooling capacity. I always look at my IAT, if I'm below the 195 engine temp and my IAT are below 145 I don't sweat it.

Stack Performance has a upgraded aluminum radiator that increasing cooling capacity for those hard core guys. I pasted a link below.

SP Aluminum Radiator for 6.1L Challenger, Charger, Magnum, 300

My temps in the afternoon are around 215 and sometime go higher if there's traffic and I'm stopped, at night its slightly below 215, ranges between 200-210... So I guess that radiator from SP should help bring this down a bit. Ill speak to Tim about it first, because I think maybe he didn't set the temperatures low enough, since he tuned the car a bit after winter so that's most likely the case.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
574 Posts
There are a few other things you could try that would work if you are close to having correct cooling capacity (which it appears from your post).

You can drain the factory coolant and rinse the system with water. Refill with pure water and use the following additives:
--Water Wetter (made by RedLine in Benecia CA)
--water pump lubricant
--anti-corrosion
If you do this you must change the water and reinstall the additives every two years.

You will get about 14% extra cooling capacity by using pure water instead of factory coolant.

All this assumes that your car will not be subjected to below 0°C temperatures, which I believe to be unlikely in your country. If you are concerned about freezing conditions, you could add a nominal amount of coolant, say 10% to compensate for lows in the -3°C range.

You must also watch the temperature carefully as the water will boil at 248°F instead of the 260°+ obtained with coolant. But the whole point of this is to keep the temperature much lower than 248!

Chrysler has three radiators. The weakest is on the R/T, the next is on the SRT, and the one with the highest capacity they call the export radiator. If your car was intended for export to Qatar, you have this export radiator. If yours is a grey market car, it may not have it, and if your dealer can install the export radiator this may be your next-easiest fix.

In any case, the after-market radiator that chukarboy recommended offers the best cooling available--better than the Chrysler export radiator.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
136 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
There are a few other things you could try that would work if you are close to having correct cooling capacity (which it appears from your post).

You can drain the factory coolant and rinse the system with water. Refill with pure water and use the following additives:
--Water Wetter (made by RedLine in Benecia CA)
--water pump lubricant
--anti-corrosion
If you do this you must change the water and reinstall the additives every two years.

You will get about 14% extra cooling capacity by using pure water instead of factory coolant.

All this assumes that your car will not be subjected to below 0°C temperatures, which I believe to be unlikely in your country. If you are concerned about freezing conditions, you could add a nominal amount of coolant, say 10% to compensate for lows in the -3°C range.

You must also watch the temperature carefully as the water will boil at 248°F instead of the 260°+ obtained with coolant. But the whole point of this is to keep the temperature much lower than 248!

Chrysler has three radiators. The weakest is on the R/T, the next is on the SRT, and the one with the highest capacity they call the export radiator. If your car was intended for export to Qatar, you have this export radiator. If yours is a grey market car, it may not have it, and if your dealer can install the export radiator this may be your next-easiest fix.

In any case, the after-market radiator that chukarboy recommended offers the best cooling available--better than the Chrysler export radiator.

Thanks OttoPilot, I think I can give this a shot since our temperatures don't come close to 0'C in the winter, so that shouldn't be an issue... My challenger is imported from the U.S. so I'm guessing it doesn't come with the export radiator that you are talking about, which might be the problem I'm having right now, so I think it would be a good idea for me to invest in that SP Radiator.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
my 2 cents, i use royal purple "purple ice" in my prostreet 'cuda, for $17 bucks its a pretty good deal, holds my temps down about 10 deg until my a&a transmission takes over and demands more of the cooling capacity. thats crusing city streets at austin tx temps, been 105 deg here for years it seems! i got a ron davis custom aluminum dual spal fan setup btw and prp electric wtr pump.
:pimp:
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,698 Posts
There is some good advice here and some less good. You have a blower so you're taxing your cooling system. Also, you're in a combination of heat and humidity so those that run in places like California which tends to be more arid (dry) are dealing with a different environment. I race in a hot and humid location with a supercharged stroker motor and this is what I can offer.

First, the recommendation to run DISTILLED water instead of a 50/50 coolant is a good one. An additive to avoid corrosion is worthwhile and you have to be sure there's no freezing situation (which you won't have in Doha...I'm assuming). Second, you're dumping extra heat from the blower into your radiator/engine cooling system. I would get an oversized radiator and have your fan running pretty much full time once your engine is up to operating temperature (that means your fans will be working pretty much full time). I purchased an oversized radiator from joelvan on the LXforum but the Stack unit recommended is another option. Mine has higher capacity but some modifications were necessary for fitment. Third, DO NOT get a lower temp thermostat...you're already cycling the fluid full time in your environment/temps so there is no value in it. I'd argue it could hurt your quest for cooling. Fourth, I'd seriously look into engine oil cooling. There is a great thread on the LXforum dot com titled Frankencooling and by having a stacked oil cooler (small radiator) with the oil cycling through it, you will pull a lot of heat from the engine. The difficulty is you already have an intercooler from the KB in the area where you would mount the oil cooler so you need to find space behind the front bumper. Not impossible, but it will take someone that knows what they are doing. Lastly, if you could get more air flowing through your engine compartment, AND OUT (most folks forget that part on MOPARS and the aftermarket hoods are not designed for exit of air), then you'll be way ahead of the game. Here's a pic of a modification that can help with airflow. The lower grill is a modified upper grill, cut to fit the lower section of the nose section/front bumper. I run this on my car.


You need to keep an eye on your engine oil temps. The coolant temps are interesting but what you really need to keep an eye on are the oil temps. The temps you have quoted are not that big a deal for your environment. they are not much higher than mine when we see 100 degree plus weather and high humidity combined. When I really get on the car (get into boost multiple times within a relatively short period) I can go well above those temps. Just don't push the engine oil temps over 230-250 degrees Fahrenheit for an extended period. And if you do, change your oil out soon thereafter. Also, run a heavier oil than 5W20. A 10W40 synthetic should be good. Your engine will appreciate it ;-)

Good luck.

HemiSam
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
136 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
There is some good advice here and some less good. You have a blower so you're taxing your cooling system. Also, you're in a combination of heat and humidity so those that run in places like California which tends to be more arid (dry) are dealing with a different environment. I race in a hot and humid location with a supercharged stroker motor and this is what I can offer.

First, the recommendation to run DISTILLED water instead of a 50/50 coolant is a good one. An additive to avoid corrosion is worthwhile and you have to be sure there's no freezing situation (which you won't have in Doha...I'm assuming). Second, you're dumping extra heat from the blower into your radiator/engine cooling system. I would get an oversized radiator and have your fan running pretty much full time once your engine is up to operating temperature (that means your fans will be working pretty much full time). I purchased an oversized radiator from joelvan on the LXforum but the Stack unit recommended is another option. Mine has higher capacity but some modifications were necessary for fitment. Third, DO NOT get a lower temp thermostat...you're already cycling the fluid full time in your environment/temps so there is no value in it. I'd argue it could hurt your quest for cooling. Fourth, I'd seriously look into engine oil cooling. There is a great thread on the LXforum dot com titled Frankencooling and by having a stacked oil cooler (small radiator) with the oil cycling through it, you will pull a lot of heat from the engine. The difficulty is you already have an intercooler from the KB in the area where you would mount the oil cooler so you need to find space behind the front bumper. Not impossible, but it will take someone that knows what they are doing. Lastly, if you could get more air flowing through your engine compartment, AND OUT (most folks forget that part on MOPARS and the aftermarket hoods are not designed for exit of air), then you'll be way ahead of the game. Here's a pic of a modification that can help with airflow. The lower grill is a modified upper grill, cut to fit the lower section of the nose section/front bumper. I run this on my car.


You need to keep an eye on your engine oil temps. The coolant temps are interesting but what you really need to keep an eye on are the oil temps. The temps you have quoted are not that big a deal for your environment. they are not much higher than mine when we see 100 degree plus weather and high humidity combined. When I really get on the car (get into boost multiple times within a relatively short period) I can go well above those temps. Just don't push the engine oil temps over 230-250 degrees Fahrenheit for an extended period. And if you do, change your oil out soon thereafter. Also, run a heavier oil than 5W20. A 10W40 synthetic should be good. Your engine will appreciate it ;-)

Good luck.

HemiSam

Thats awesome Hemisam!! I'm definitely gonna try some of these things out for sure, I'll let u know when I see some results :D
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top