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Discussion Starter #1
So I wanted to upgrade my speaker system and after lots of reading reviews and articles I decided on these for my door speakers and I'm sort of disappointed. They don't seem like they kick as hard as the stock speakers but everything I read said they're great. They're 4ohm which could be the problem but I couldn't find any speakers that we less then that that actually had good reviews. Also, are our rear speakers 6.5 or 6 3/4? I read they're 6.5 but the 6.5 speakers I bought, shown below, didn't fit at all because they were way too small. Any help would be great because I'm pretty lost on what went wrong.


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The Bacon Hauler (‘12 Cop Charger)
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I am no expert when it comes to automobile audio systems, but I've done quite a bit of reading and research on upgrading the stock systems in these cars, and from that I have learned there are a few things to keep in mind when purchasing aftermarket hardware.

1) you want the smallest number of "ways" you can get on your speakers.

In other words, 2-way is preferable to 3-way, and 3-way is preferable to 4-way, and so on. The more "ways" the speaker has, the more it has to divide the given surface area of its speaker cone up to cover those "ways", and that means none of them (especially the low end driver) will sound really great (since the speaker has to make them all sound just good enough). Plus, the power the speaker uses has to be divided up among all the pieces, leaving less for the actual low-end driver component.

So in that context, I would not be surprised that a 5-way 6x9 had less punch in its low end when compared to the OE 6x9, which is basically just a 1-way devoted to low-end sound only.

2) if the factory head unit is going to power the aftermarket speaker, the RMS wattage of the speakers should be relatively low.

Keeping the RMS low allows the full abilities of the speaker to be realized with the relatively small amount of power the factory head unit will be providing. Conversely, a speaker that has a high RMS requirement will not have its best sound quality fully realized with a factory head unit because the factory head unit is just not providing enough power to do so.

As for the 6x9s you have, I could not find a RMS wattage value for them when I looked them up, which is very curious all by itself. Nevertheless, given the 5-way thing and your description of their lack of low-end punch, I am going to say it is certainly possible, maybe even likely, that they are not getting sufficient power to produce their best sound.

Would upgrading the head-unit to an aftermarket one with more watts per channel help? Probably, but it's hard to say how much without knowing the speakers' RMS wattage.


As for the 6.5" speakers not fitting, I cannot say what's up with that. As far as I knew, the rear deck speakers were 6.5", but anything from a 5.25" to a 6.75" speaker will fit back there, as long as you have the adapter brackets to allow installation. Now, from what I understood, the adapters were for the misaligned screw holes between the speakers and the deck; I didn't think they had anything to do with the size of the hole. Maybe that's not the case, I don't know. You'll have to do more research on that one.


So given all that, did you make a bad choice? Unfortunately I am going to say yes. It sounds like the 6x9s just aren't good for replacing what was already there. Their driver components probably aren't big enough, and it's likely they aren't getting enough power to fully push them.

And at the very least, you are going to need some adapter brackets to make the rear deck speakers work, so without those, it's hard to say whether or not your purchase there was a good one or not.

FWIW: I have read (and somewhat agree with) others state that the rear deck speakers don't contribute enough to the overall sound to warrant spending a lot of money on them. Just having some decent ones back there is good enough in other words.


Nuke
 

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Discussion Starter #3
That's what I was afraid I was going to hear. There 100RMS which is the same as the infinity speakers so many people in here recommend and love, so I don't think that's the problem. It must be the amount of ways like you said. I guess I'll take them out and return them for some different ones. Do you know about the ohm rating? Everything I found was for subwoofers not normal speakers. Like I said these are 4ohm and that's almost all I could find with where I'm going to buy my speakers, is that going to be a huge problem?

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Crutchfield is a good source. I think they sell speaker mount and adapters etc.
I too want to upgrade my speakers but it looks like a huge PITA!
Lots to select from on the website
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Yeah I looked for hours before I bought those and I still screwed up lol. Replacing them wasnt that hard at all surprisingly. But now I get to go return the two sets I got and find new ones, which means uninstalling the door speakers and then reinstalling the new ones..... Again.... This time I'm going into the store and looking around instead of hoping for the best online.
 

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The Bacon Hauler (‘12 Cop Charger)
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Crutchfield is a pretty useful website, even if you aren't going to buy from them. If it were me, I would hit Crutchfield.com and input my car (year, trim, etc.) and then tell it you want to shop around for speakers. The website will then tell you which ones will fit the various mounting locations. That will at least give you an idea of the specs you should be looking at when shopping elsewhere.

Then go ahead and pick a set for each mounting location and add them to your shopping cart. Then go look at the shopping cart, and you will have all the extra accessories listed for each set of speakers that you will need to install the speakers yourself (mounting brackets, wiring harness adapters, etc.). Using those part numbers, you can find the accessories elsewhere or even buy from them if necessary.

As for the RMS rating of those 6x9s, 100 watts RMS is going to be too much for your factory head-unit to push (without a factory amp, which it doesn't sound like you have). Ideally, you would want any replacement speakers to have an RMS rating of 2-50 watts, with 15 probably being the sweet spot.

But on the flip side, with an RMS rating that high, you could push them with an amp, and in doing so, you should improve their sound quality quite a bit. Now would that be worth all the hassle you would have to go through to install an aftermarket amp into an otherwise factory system? That's hard to say...it's going to be a different answer for everybody, but I am leaning toward "no, it wouldn't be worth all the extra trouble" in your case.

Something to think about though...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I'm not sure if I have an amp or not. There was a small black box in the back when I removed the cover to get to the rear speakers that had all the speaker wire coming out of it. It didn't look like an amp so I assume it wasn't one but I couldn't think of anything else it could be. If I remember correctly I have the sound group one, I only have the 6 Alpine speakers not the 9 or the Harmon Karmin ones.

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The Bacon Hauler (‘12 Cop Charger)
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I'm not sure if I have an amp or not. There was a small black box in the back when I removed the cover to get to the rear speakers that had all the speaker wire coming out of it. It didn't look like an amp so I assume it wasn't one but I couldn't think of anything else it could be. If I remember correctly I have the sound group one, I only have the 6 Alpine speakers not the 9 or the Harmon Karmin ones.

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If you have a factory amp, it would be mounted behind the dash panel below the steering wheel IIRC. So I think you can just reach up and behind that plastic panel and feel around (or remove it to be thorough) to see if you have one for sure.

Another way I think you can tell is by checking your rear fuse box (the one in the trunk, just behind the battery) for a fuse in the slot for audio amplifier. Check your owner's manual for a fuse layout for that box, and it should designate one of them as being for the audio amplifier. If your fuse box doesn't have a fuse in that slot, I think it's safe to say you do not have a amp (or it's not working if you do). And if it does, you most likely do have a factory amp.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Alright, so i looked at Mopars website where you type in your VIN and they tell you everything your car has and they said I have the 276 watt amp in it. Checked the fuse box and there's a fuse there for it. So, with it having one, I assume I should still go for the lower watt speakers like you're saying, but even on crutchfield only two of the 6x9 speakers that I found is below 100. Everything is either 100 or 150. And like I said, the Infinity one's that so many people on here love as straight drop in replacements is 100 watts, and everybody else says that they sound amazing and are a huge upgrade. I think if anything it's the 5 way though, i think the infinity only has a two or a three way option, so I guess when i go get new ones I'll just have to get a two way, or one way with good lows since thats really all the door speakers are good for. Nuke did you upgrade your system at all?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
And for the rear speakers I know they don't play a huge part in the sound but I want them to. Like I actually want a good full all around sound, can that even happen with the stock amp/ head unit or would I absolutely have to get an aftermarket amp for that? Or has anybody removed the material above the speaker so it isn't as muffled? I fell like it's a huge part of the sound issue having it completely covered by that rear deck cover.
 

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The Bacon Hauler (‘12 Cop Charger)
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Alright, so i looked at Mopars website where you type in your VIN and they tell you everything your car has and they said I have the 276 watt amp in it. Checked the fuse box and there's a fuse there for it. So, with it having one, I assume I should still go for the lower watt speakers like you're saying, but even on crutchfield only two of the 6x9 speakers that I found is below 100. Everything is either 100 or 150. And like I said, the Infinity one's that so many people on here love as straight drop in replacements is 100 watts, and everybody else says that they sound amazing and are a huge upgrade. I think if anything it's the 5 way though, i think the infinity only has a two or a three way option, so I guess when i go get new ones I'll just have to get a two way, or one way with good lows since thats really all the door speakers are good for. Nuke did you upgrade your system at all?
With the factory amp, you might can push the 100 watt RMS. So you're back to getting some 2-way or maybe 3-way speakers with good low end. 1-way would be components, which you technically already have (3.5" in dash are other half of door components), so getting another set would require replacing the dash too.

I have wanted to do the speaker upgrade in both the challengers I've had, but like someone already said, it just gets to be a little overwhelming at some point, and so both times I held off while I did yet more research on options.

And both times, I happen to catch a great deal on a powered subwoofer while in a holding pattern, and so I bought and installed it to beef up the sound's lower end. Both times gave me what i was after, and so i didn't do my more.

1St Chalenger had the stock 6 speaker sound system, no amp. I added a 10" Infinity powered sub (full size) to that system, mounting it in the trunk facing rearward.

2nd Challenger had stock 4 speaker system (no amp), and i added a 8" Infinity powered sub (low-profile) to it, mounting it behind the driver's seat and facing forward.

Both times the sound improved quite a bit, and was worth the sale prices I paid for the subs. Both both times, i would stop shirt of recommending the same subs at full price, ad im not sure the sound improved that much. Just one of those ROI deals for me...
 

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I'm also no expert, but here's what I know. The stock speakers (although apparently paper, and not high quality) are 2ohm. The Infinity reference speakers are 3 ohm. I think the reason people like the infinity is because at 3 ohm, they likely don't lose much, and their superior quality construction makes them sound better than stock. The door speakers are lows only, so even a 2 way will not use the tweeter. On a 5 way none of the smaller drivers are likely used. Rear speakers that fit range from 5 1/4" to 6 1/2". that doesn't mean any speaker that size is a direct fit. Design and dimensions would determine that.

A Guy
 

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So much bad information in this thread. It should be nuked.
So good you could bless us with your presence...if not some "good" info. A Guy
 

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Sorry if I came off as derogatory. I hate bad information in forum posts. I typed a big long response of the issues, but decided against posting it.

In a nutshell, the OP bought cheap speakers, and wonders why they sound like cheap speakers. 6X9 is a great size for bass/mid bass. Most people seem to put Infinity speakers in these car doors. That might be the best place to start.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Sorry if I came off as derogatory. I hate bad information in forum posts. I typed a big long response of the issues, but decided against posting it.

In a nutshell, the OP bought cheap speakers, and wonders why they sound like cheap speakers. 6X9 is a great size for bass/mid bass. Most people seem to put Infinity speakers in these car doors. That might be the best place to start.
So what defines a cheap speaker? Because the ones I bought are listed at like $130 or so on pioneers website, which is on par with infinity. I know that price doesn't always determine how good the speakers will work because that always varies on a person's setup. If you have information I would love to hear it, no matter how long it ends up being. I posted on here in hopes to learn and make a better choice the second time around so any help really is appreciated.

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The Bacon Hauler (‘12 Cop Charger)
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So good you could bless us with your presence...if not some "good" info. A Guy
You're just jealous because he referenced me by name! :grin2:
 

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Ok. The first red flag on those speakers is the 650 Watts label on the box. The manufacturers website says they are rated at 600 watts peak. 80 nominal. Per pair. Real world rating is 40 watts per speaker. This is something manufacturers do to make their products look impressive. The 276 watt 6 speaker system in our cars (I have it also) is really something like 20 watts per channel. Peak power is meaningless, RMS is everything.

Let me explain peak and RMS or nominal power. Peak power is measured with a test tone. Of a specific frequency. Pushed thru the speakers until they distort. Unless you plan on riding around listening to a test tone, peak power rating is meaningless. If car horse power were measured this way it would be like measuring the Horsepower of your car, going downhill, with a hellcat pushing it. Peak power is meaningless.

RMS or nominal wattage rating is how many watts a speaker can handle thru a variety of frequencies. Notice all the expensive speakers are higher RMS? Its their rating. The higher the RMS rating of speakers the better. That's why you cant find good speakers with low RMS ratings.

The infinity speakers sound good in our cars because first they are made with good materials. Second they have good sensitivity. For an example, to get 100 db out of the factory speakers, the volume might be at 6. With more efficient speakers the volume might only need to be at 5 to get the same level of sound.

The 2 way vs 5 way is a matter of personal preference. In our case, it really doesn't matter as the door aren't getting a full signal. The fact that there are 5 drivers could be hurting the sound. In our set up a 2 way or even a 1 way midbass driver is ok.

If you can return these I would do that. Get the Infinity's that everyone is happy with. If you can't return them, give these speakers some time. Speakers need a break in and will generally sound better after some time. This may be the case with your speakers.

I'm an older guy, and past my days of blasting tunes while out cruising around are over. That said, what I will most likely do is replace all the speakers with the Infinity's and add a small sub.
 
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