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Toyota Corolla, Toyota Camry, and Honda Civic prove that while pickups and crossovers are king, Japanese sedans are still selling just fine.

Honda Civic US car sales figures

2018 =325,760
2017 =377,286
2016 =366,927
2015 =335,384
2014 =325,981
2013 =336,180
2012 =317,909
2011 =221,235
2010 =260,218
Just fine... well... sales going down is becoming a worry even to Toyota and Honda execs. The Accord is now in a 3 year sales slide.. and THAT is even with an all new Accord for 2018. The Camry is on a 3 year sales slide even with an all new Camry, The Corolla is on a 2 year sales slide and that car used to be a Top 10 seller.. no more. All for of these models used to be in the Top 4-8 sales slot in the US and I think now only the Camry is in the Top 10. These 4 models have been gaining and/or not losing as much as the few people that ARE car buyers have left the domestics and bought these.
 

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It needs updating - much like how the Town Car was, it looked the same whether it was a '98 or 2011.
That's why I'm impress with the "new" Continental. One would say, the car sucks and failed to come close to BMW, Benz, Lexus. But it's got suicide doors (again.) We can talk about 500hp or g handling, but I think there is a market for "style." That's ultra cool for a car to pull up, and the doors open the other way.

Anyhow, that's my feel about the 300. Yes, it still looks good, but it needs to be "cool" again. What that means, I don't know exactly. If I do, I would be working for FCA. I think the key for 300 is not to make a Hellcat 300, or Demon 300. It needs something that makes it cool.
 

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Honestly, Chrysler is pretty rock bottom where it is right now, if it wasn't for the rest of FCA they would have likely gone bankrupt long ago. I think they should embrace hybrid and work towards EV, and adopt 1950's nuclear family, "CAR OF THE FUTURE" vibe and styling.
Well, I mean there are only two Chrysler branded vehicles right? The 300 and the Pacifica is all I can think of. The Pacifica is ranked #2 in its class, and arguably a better vehicle than the Odyssey. The 300, I think you're exactly right and a refresh and good marketing campaign could turn it around.

For a while we had "box cars" that were all going extinct, and all but one did, the Kia Soul, which actually increased in sales after the hugely successful hamster ad campaign where they sold the image of a carefree fun vehicle that doesn't take itself too seriously (the new ones too like the jelly bean one are along the same image).

One reason we actually went for the Charger over the 300, since originally we weren't even looking at the Scat Pack we ended up with, was because 300s seemed to show up in too many rap videos and transitional neighborhood urban apartment complexes and the like and to me felt like a "ghetto" image, whereas the Charger had more of a retro patriotic americana muscle vibe to it.
 

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I will say this - the main reason that I was attracted to and bought a Challenger is *because* of the 45-year-old styling! :)
This is what I'd like styling wise, but on a diet to get it around 3.6K lbs like the original:

LED headlights can be made ultra slim now, in any shape you want, since the diodes are tiny, so you could do the hidden headlights without even needing a flap I bet. DRL can be C-shaped on the grill circumference. Or the small LED headlamps could be made to be where foglamps are. We've seen other companies experimenting with non-traditional headlight designs now thanks to LED, so why not that? And with the fold flat seats and fastback design (with the glass opening with the trunk for a huge opening), you would capture the crossover/hatchback market for the practicality of it, since you would be able to do a homedepot trip with it. Especially if you don't make it super low to the ground to keep a little ground clearance, which the original had too.
 

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We're never getting 3600lbs again.


Cars today have more safety features, more reinforcement, more sound deadening. You want 3600lbs, you're going to go have to buy a Porsche.
 

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We're never getting 3600lbs again.


Cars today have more safety features, more reinforcement, more sound deadening. You want 3600lbs, you're going to go have to buy a Porsche.
I thought the next Challenger would be based on the Alfa Romeo Giulia platform, no?

https://www.caranddriver.com/alfa-romeo/giulia/specs
Base Curb Weight : lbs 3521

Subtract two doors (-60lbs), do like the F-150 and make some of the body panels aluminum (hood), add a bigger engine like the 5.7 liter (150-200lbs+), and maybe could be done in the 3.6-3.7K range? With 375hp, that would still give you a 9.7lbs/hp ratio which would still be very quick, and because of tire size limitations probably get very similar 0-60mph times to a 485hp Scat Pack on street tires, and the lighter weight should mean better braking and handling all else equal.

The high performance version could be a electrically-assisted turbocharged 5.7L for instant spool and gobs of torque and increase effective displacement to at least match the 6.4L, even using a high compression ratio low-boost smaller turbo setup. At that point you'd have the same 485hp but in a lighter vehicle which should be crazy quick, and avoid gas guzzler tax. *shrugs*
 

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I thought the next Challenger would be based on the Alfa Romeo Giulia platform, no?

https://www.caranddriver.com/alfa-romeo/giulia/specs
Base Curb Weight : lbs 3521

Subtract two doors (-60lbs), do like the F-150 and make some of the body panels aluminum (hood), add a bigger engine like the 5.7 liter (150-200lbs+), and maybe could be done in the 3.6-3.7K range? With 375hp, that would still give you a 9.7lbs/hp ratio which would still be very quick, and because of tire size limitations probably get very similar 0-60mph times to a 485hp Scat Pack on street tires, and the lighter weight should mean better braking and handling all else equal.

It is not as far as we've heard.


Either way, hoods are already aluminum and all of that would basically make the car smaller.

I don't want a lighter car at the expense of size. That's the 3rd reason I love the car beside looks and sound.






If you want a smaller, lighter car, go buy a Porsche, let me know what you can fit in there besides a midget in clown shoes and a bag of groceries.
 

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It is not as far as we've heard.


Either way, hoods are already aluminum and all of that would basically make the car smaller.

I don't want a lighter car at the expense of size. That's the 3rd reason I love the car beside looks and sound.


If they make the next gen Challenger the same size as the Camaro and Mustang so they can loose some weight then the main advantage is gone and then it only comes down to styling and brand preferences.





If you want a smaller, lighter car, go buy a Porsche, let me know what you can fit in there besides a midget in clown shoes and a bag of groceries.
I agree. A Camaro or Mustang is also in that lighter weight class but they are also cramped inside. I am more of a GM guy and the Challenger is the first and now second Chrysler product I have ever bought. I have no interest in the other two mostly based on size.

I want a comfortable car that has a usable trunk with great styling and plenty of power, the Challenger delivers all of those better than any car in the market.
 

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I don't want a lighter car at the expense of size. That's the 3rd reason I love the car beside looks and sound.

If you want a smaller, lighter car, go buy a Porsche, let me know what you can fit in there besides a midget in clown shoes and a bag of groceries.
Remember the current chassis is basically a last generation E-series, from 2007 I think, and over a decade of technological development means you can make a chassis strong and still lighter without really having to make it much smaller.

Look at the F150 that I mentioned, they didn't make it smaller, in fact I think it grew a tiny bit, but they cut a ton of weight with a ton of little changes.

Remember the original Charger/Challenger weren't full-size vehicles even for their day, they were still midsize. I believe the Giulia is considered a midsize chassis, and you can always stretch it a tiny bit by making the trunk a little longer for example.
 

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Bought my Challenger for the stylish looks it has and the roominess for tall people like me with long legs. It doesn't have the leg room my Ram 3500 dually does but it perfect for a car. The trunk is big they could leave out the rear set that wouldn't bother me. With my seat all the way back there isn't any way someone can sit behind my driver seat. The 2 things they could change is electric set back tilt instead of the lever and auto up on the window switch. Other than that my car is perfect like it is no changes needed leave it alone. If I wanted an electric car I'd have gotten something else to drive. If I wanted to cart more than my woman around I would have gotten a Charge.
 

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Remember the current chassis is basically a last generation E-series, from 2007 I think, and over a decade of technological development means you can make a chassis strong and still lighter without really having to make it much smaller.

Look at the F150 that I mentioned, they didn't make it smaller, in fact I think it grew a tiny bit, but they cut a ton of weight with a ton of little changes.

Remember the original Charger/Challenger weren't full-size vehicles even for their day, they were still midsize. I believe the Giulia is considered a midsize chassis, and you can always stretch it a tiny bit by making the trunk a little longer for example.
If it doesn't compromise size, then I'm all for it.

If it does, it goes out the window.
 

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Bought my Challenger for the stylish looks it has and the roominess for tall people like me with long legs. It doesn't have the leg room my Ram 3500 dually does but it perfect for a car. The trunk is big they could leave out the rear set that wouldn't bother me. With my seat all the way back there isn't any way someone can sit behind my driver seat. The 2 things they could change is electric set back tilt instead of the lever and auto up on the window switch. Other than that my car is perfect like it is no changes needed leave it alone. If I wanted an electric car I'd have gotten something else to drive. If I wanted to cart more than my woman around I would have gotten a Charge.
Trust me, I've been in a Charger, there isn't that much space in the back.

If you want something to carry 4 people comfortably, get a Sonata. That thing has leg and headroom for days.
 

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Trust me, I've been in a Charger, there isn't that much space in the back.

If you want something to carry 4 people comfortably, get a Sonata. That thing has leg and headroom for days.
The Charger is a full size sedan chassis, and the back leg room you mention on the Sonata is less than the Charger. You must have sat in a Charger with the front seats maxed back or something. Just kick the people in the front or flick their ears or something and make them scooch.

https://www.caranddriver.com/hyundai/sonata/specs
vs
https://www.caranddriver.com/dodge/charger/specs/

Second Head Room : in 38 vs 36.6 (Sonata wins)
Second Leg Room : in 35.6 vs 40.1 (Charger wins)
Second Shoulder Room : in 56.5 vs 57.9 (Charger wins)
Second Hip Room : in 56.1 vs 56.1 (tie)
 

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The Charger is a full size sedan chassis, and the back leg room you mention on the Sonata is less than the Charger. You must have sat in a Charger with the front seats maxed back or something. Just kick the people in the front or flick their ears or something and make them scooch.

https://www.caranddriver.com/hyundai/sonata/specs
vs
https://www.caranddriver.com/dodge/charger/specs/

Second Head Room : in 38 vs 36.6 (Sonata wins)
Second Leg Room : in 35.6 vs 40.1 (Charger wins)
Second Shoulder Room : in 56.5 vs 57.9 (Charger wins)
Second Hip Room : in 56.1 vs 56.1 (tie)
I've owned a Sonata, my dad has owned a Sonata, and I've sat in the back of my co-workers Scat Pack Charger.

Sonata has more legroom hands down.
 

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The 200 was heading down the “Reliant K”car path, (no thank you Mr.Iacocca)....I propose bringing back the Magnum, I’m sure SRT would do a superb job on a refresh tweak for a car that folks would definitely buy in a Hellcat trim
 

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Not sure why the 200 gets so much hate we have one and it's been an awesome car. Been driven to Michigan a couple of times from Oklahoma averaging 80 mph with 30+ mpg with the 3.6L only thing that has broke was a latch for center console. Car is working on 85,000 miles.

Mopar or No Car
 

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Honestly, Chrysler is pretty rock bottom where it is right now, if it wasn't for the rest of FCA they would have likely gone bankrupt long ago. I think they should embrace hybrid and work towards EV, and adopt 1950's nuclear family, "CAR OF THE FUTURE" vibe and styling.
Bring back Flight-Sweep. :icon7:
 

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That's why I'm impress with the "new" Continental. One would say, the car sucks and failed to come close to BMW, Benz, Lexus. But it's got suicide doors (again.) We can talk about 500hp or g handling, but I think there is a market for "style." That's ultra cool for a car to pull up, and the doors open the other way.
The Continental didn't fail to come close to BMW, MB or Lexus, because it was never the intention. Sadly, only 80 vehicles were built with suicide doors and 8,758 were sold in 2018. It seems that it won't be around much longer.

Great Cars Nobody Bought in 2018

One reason we actually went for the Charger over the 300, since originally we weren't even looking at the Scat Pack we ended up with, was because 300s seemed to show up in too many rap videos and transitional neighborhood urban apartment complexes and the like and to me felt like a "ghetto" image, whereas the Charger had more of a retro patriotic americana muscle vibe to it.
The Charger is retro in name only.

Remember the original Charger/Challenger weren't full-size vehicles even for their day, they were still midsize. I believe the Giulia is considered a midsize chassis, and you can always stretch it a tiny bit by making the trunk a little longer for example.
FCA has stated that none of the Euro platforms will be used on the next generation and instead the current one will be modified. Of course, with FCA that can change depending on the direction the wind is blowing.
 

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Not sure why the 200 gets so much hate we have one and it's been an awesome car. Been driven to Michigan a couple of times from Oklahoma averaging 80 mph with 30+ mpg with the 3.6L only thing that has broke was a latch for center console. Car is working on 85,000 miles.

Mopar or No Car
The then FCA CEO (RIP) said the rear headroom was tight. But that's the coupe like styling they were going for. I think he just wanted a reason to build more Jeeps (SUVs) because it was more profitable. The only way was to axe the cars. FCA did spend a lot of $$$ on R&D on the 200. It was a good car. Ok, the 9 speed auto sucks, but that's ZF's fault. Honda has the same issues with the ZF. But Honda finally tuned it right on 2019 (Pilot). 200 never got the chance/attention from FCA to make it work.

I'm sure SUVs are profitable, but 200,000 units of Chrysler 200 can surely keep guys working and pay the electric bill. Nothing wrong with being 4th, 5th, 6th place in mid size sedan sales.
 
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