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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello all. I am about to install a Procharger on my 15 SRT 392. I have been tossing around the idea of adding long tubes but not sure if it is worth it. I was thinking on the lines of it reducing the stress on the internals some as it should drop pressure down about 1 psi and still maintain the same hp. On the flip side, I hear under hood temps go up with long tubes unless you coat them which can have cracking issues. I am in South Florida and it gets hot hear so with the added heat will it offset the gains? Also understand if I want cats I will need the green cats with boost or go straight pipe and deal with the smell. I am also lowered but don't really deal with speed bumps or ground clearance issues often. I mean $3k for headers and cats is a big chunk of coin for 25hp. This is just a street car that will probably never see a track as there isn't one real close to me. Not looking to get every hp I can or hit a dyno number. Just looking for solid daily power without having to build a motor. Anyone have any input on the subject? Car is totally stock except KW's and catch can. Fully understand pistons and rods or get the Hellcat. Are headers worth it for the reduced stress on the pistons as it will be a more efficient air pump? Is it $3k worth?
 

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2017 challenger hellcat A8
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25hp for $3,000 not remotely worth it. If you going to spend $3,000 get forged drop in pistons and rods.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
25hp for $3,000 not remotely worth it. If you going to spend $3,000 get forged drop in pistons and rods.
I would if that is what it would cost. $3k just gets rods and pistons with maybe gaskets. If the motor is coming out, it's a full rebuild witch is going to be $10-$15k all said and done. Then I could run about 12psi witch would be the limit before the trans lets go. Not to mention the rear end, axels, drive shaft and... Just building a street car so maybe just put the blower on and call it a day.
 

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2017 challenger hellcat A8
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He is not pulling the motor. Forged custom cut pistons and rods when I did my 392 several years ago came in right around $2000. If he is not doing the labor himself then another $1200-1500 for labor.
 

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2011 SXT Built in the Canada Plant
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You do realize a PCM Upgrade and Tune will have to be done then when you add Boost by a Supercharger, Procharger, Turbo your gonna get heat here in Fl yeah you better cool it better as well. You need to use a low Compression Engine, you need higher volume Injectors, etc., its a huge cost and then extra breaking upgrade to slow it down..
 

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2017 challenger hellcat A8
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To me it is not very clear how much experience you have with this generation of Hemi engine. Obviously you will need a tune. If you are not going to do anything to the internals the tune needs to be “spot on” or if you push the car hard you risk the pistons. How much psi are you looking to use?
 

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2011 gwe srt
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it can be and will have to be unlocked and then tuned. Slap a supercharger on a 392 even at 6 psi and dont tune it your lucky if you make one full power pass without parts on the ground or holes in your pistons.

original poster what ill say is 25 hp is a good increase in power. Is it worth 3k? probably not but thats the entry price if that means something to you. I would probably buy them if doing an na build but maybe in your case where you not looking for the highest possible numbers id compromise and just put a cat back on it. If nothing else you gain a few hp and loose a good chunk of weight and the right one just sounds so nice. If numbers count and i had 3k id probably spend it on a blower cam and then save for headers. But even at supercharger alone numbers id loose sleep and be clenching my gut everytime i got on it thinking a piston is going to pop so personaly id do a drop in piston swap before i even bought the supercharger. Maybe the best idea is to do the piston upgrade buy a set of headers and a cat back and do a blower cam. that could be done for the price of a supercharger. then start saving again until you can afford to do a super charger right. Just a cam and exhaust would probably net you half the hp a super charger would SAFELY.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I have the Procharger already. Been sitting on it for a year. Trying to figure out what direction to go. My 392 has just over 40k miles on it. That is the top end of the just drop in. My understanding is that the 392 can look great with still seeing crosshatch at 100k miles or be well worn at 30k miles. Will not know until the heads are off. My mindset is if I am going to put pistons in it, I am changing the lifters to non MDS with the heads off. If I am changing the lifters, I am changing the cam. If changing the cam , well springs and pushrods should be changed. Heads off, put long tubes on as no change in labor. And if changing all that, pull the crank and put all new bearings in it. Full rebuild. Don't know if I want to spend that kind of money on a perfectly healthy motor. I know it is the safest thing to do and I could boost the hell out of it but at the end of the day, it's still just a street car. There are plenty of guys running around at a safeish 575-580hp with plenty of fuel to keep the temps down. It isn't as much of an issue as it once was. Just can't get greedy which is easier said than done. But yes, I would feel better if pistons are in it and still may go that route. I may just put a cam in it and ditch the Procharger. May not even do anything.

My original question was, would long tubes help reduce stress off the internals? Is 1 to 1.5 pound of reduced boost enough to justify the cost of the longtubes? I could use SW at a much lower cost with no cats but can be stinky. Kooks with green cats are going to be around $2500 plus install.
 

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When you super charge you want a Lower Compression Engine, you want different heat Range Plugs, you need different Injectors and in short a PCM Unlock or Replacement and then a tune to make it all work right. Its never just a bolt on and go with these cars its not that simple. There is so much to make it right or you will have a disaster waiting to happen. A good professional install and done right is High Dollars there is no short cuts to a Supercharger / Procharger, Turbo Charger.... Today that Computer has to be in Sync and its a multiple upgrade to get the most out of it and make it work without scattering it over the Road. Just Bolt and Go HP is a sales pitch they wont be the ones fixing your Car.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
When you super charge you want a Lower Compression Engine, you want different heat Range Plugs, you need different Injectors and in short a PCM Unlock or Replacement and then a tune to make it all work right. Its never just a bolt on and go with these cars its not that simple. There is so much to make it right or you will have a disaster waiting to happen. A good professional install and done right is High Dollars there is no short cuts to a Supercharger / Procharger, Turbo Charger.... Today that Computer has to be in Sync and its a multiple upgrade to get the most out of it and make it work without scattering it over the Road. Just Bolt and Go HP is a sales pitch they wont be the ones fixing your Car.
I am totally aware of that. I am having American Modern Performance do the install and tuning. I could do it all my self except the tuning but I feel they should just do the whole thing as that is what they do every day. It's the tuning that makes or breaks it. These guys are MMX dealers and are mostly Dodge guys. I am weighing the pros and cons at this point. The debate goes, why spend $10-$15k on the motor and still have the driveline to deal with. The trans can hold about 700-750hp with proper tuning but still need the rest of it. This is where the Hellcat logic comes in. I am not looking to be cheap. I am trying to figure out if I just put the Procharger on it with proper tuning and call it a day. I can always add some Meth and not tune for it. Just use it for temp reduction. Not going to be tracked. Just street car with some spirited driving from time to time.

My reason for the post was about headers and the side affect of reduced boost while keeping the same HP. Logic states, with less boost would reduce stress and heat. My question is, would that be enough reduction to justify the cost of longtubes. Not looking to debate why I should build a forged motor.
 

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If I was you and already had the Procharger I would install it at 6psi and leave it just like that. With a good tune there are guys with a bunch of miles on them and no problems. Long tubes will not make it safer and it's a big chunk of money for the return.

That will give you plenty of time to save up a bunch of money if you want to take the next step and up the boost. Then if you decide to up the boost I would get long tubes at that time where the exhaust flow is much greater because of the higher boost levels.
 

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IMO I would not boost (or run nitrous) a 6.4 unless it had forged pistons (and rods to boot) or a tad more ring gap. They are not as tolerant to boost in OEM form as the 5.7 since they run high CR and the top ring sits closer to the piston surface. Any mishap in overboost/fueling/spark/tune and the top ring landing will most likely pop and potentially destroy the engine. I have seen pics of broken landings and remember one instance where I saw bent rods (still looking for that thread - might have not been on CT). Although procharger type superchargers deliver more linear and controlled boost as opposed to whipple/KB/magnuson type and usually have a more efficient air-air intercooler set-up...hence cooler aircharge. However, if you go forged (lot of work and kinda pricey) they produce monster power.

The 6.4 does net some gains (not as much as the 5.7 with its stock log type manifold) with headers but then you might run into emissions issues even running high flow cats. However, if you are trying to be thrifty and gain as much power as you can, it might be best to just get a used HC (yes I know, everyone and their uncle says that). In my case, I spent $31k on my RT out the door, went boosted, cam, headers (plus other things like driveshaft etc.) and did all the work myself and it put me at ~$41k...hard to find an HC for that price. However, if I had all the mods installed by a shop I would be easily in used HC territory.

In the end, it's how much you are willing to pay to play? If you are not doing the work yourself...then I really would be looking into a used hell cat. Seen more than a few people disappointed in gains with what they spent, and not only that they typically used a shop not as familiar with dodge tuning (a knowledgeable shop is key) and complain about driveability.
 

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Is it $3k worth
If you're spending $3k for headers then NO. Keep shopping and you can find high quality headers for around $1k, and with mid pipes and all.
 

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If I was you and already had the Procharger I would install it at 6psi and leave it just like that. With a good tune there are guys with a bunch of miles on them and no problems. Long tubes will not make it safer and it's a big chunk of money for the return.

That will give you plenty of time to save up a bunch of money if you want to take the next step and up the boost. Then if you decide to up the boost I would get long tubes at that time where the exhaust flow is much greater because of the higher boost levels.
I have to agree. Unless you got a heck of deal on it youll loose money selling it and you already have it. Id put it on at 6psi with a GOOD SAFE DYNO TUNE going in with reliability in mind and not squeezing the last possible hp out of it and call it a day. IF you want more the first step should be pistons. Keep in mind too you already have shorty headers so your not going to see the gains the 5.7 guys do on a 6.4.
 
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