Dodge Challenger Forum banner

1 - 20 of 85 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited by Moderator)
My scat pak shaker challenger seems to be doing what its not supposed to do.11.62 and 3.3 zero to sixty mph. All with nothing more than some tin foil, rubber tubing, and under inflated under rim sized tires!
OH and a Hemifever tune (which isn't supposed to do much).

Shall I explain? OK.

I bought this for the useless shaker hood. Traded in my 2011 5.7 RT .
challenger 6.jpg
..
977670
. What What a deal, for this 2016 beast I thought....as it would do 0-60 in 4.3 seconds over my rt's 4.6
seconds. BUT WAIT THERE'S MORE!

Soon the yearning began to take it to the local tack, something I havn't done in 40 years since going to the old national speedway on long island and doing 19 seconds in a v8 Gremlin. My first runs were horrific...but I was having fun! 12.737 and no better than 2.1 60 foot. Horrible...this isn't any fun. I had cars with schnitzle decals beating me...with the sales sticker still in the window. So I started reading the forums, became more confused but wound up buying a set of MT 245/35/20 dr's. That helped a bit......a very little bit!. I was able to knock the 0-60 to 1.85 avg...and my et to 12.4.

I am not a quitter so realizing that if your spinning your wheels.....your just spinning your wheels I bought some 17 inch wheels and a new set of MT's. I also invested in a Hemifever tune on a Diablo.

Ok....this all started in late June and its now mid July. Into august we got rain and no strip. I insulated the air intakes and....remember when i said "USELESS SHAKER" .... I addressed some of that deficiency.


20190825_193708[1].jpg
20190825_193731[1].jpg
20190825_193835[1].jpg


So after that we got jiggy and decided the beat the crap outta the car the old school way. With the tune, the 17 inch mt wheels, the upgrades for ai temp...and reviewing videos 1 frame at a time....we got the essentially stock challenger 6.4 to 11.619 with 60' at 1.518.
977671
OH...and 3.3 second zero to sixty. NOW I HAVE TO FIND A HOBBY.






















Oh and I sealed the massive air leak top of the cai on the shaker, installed the through grill tubing, virtually eliminating the hot air problem. I think I'm gonna work on the suspension as I still get some spin if I launch over 2000 rpm..thinking adjustable shocks to reduce recovery time on rear tires ( but what do I know?)..until I have news .......Later folks.

20190821_193204_Moment (2).jpg



You can see my blog at https://toechopperrants.blogspot.com/2019/06/attn-race-fans.html
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
Im trying another local tuner......I will report. Wed is track night.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,293 Posts
Very impressive! Cecil is a pretty quick track, and your 1.51 60 foot is just insane!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
92 Posts
Very good passes for sure. I also started with a Hemifever tune. My local tuner "Accelerated Racing Solutions" was very impressed and said it looked very good. However with the actual car sitting on the dyno in front of the tuner they have a little advantage over a remote tuner. The Hemifever tune definitely allowed my tuner the ability to get the tune dialed in much faster. I would definitely go that route again. Hemifever tune, then off to my busy tuner. An aggressive 100 octane tune and lite wheels and tires is where my car really shined. 121mph in 350' DA!! My best 60' however was only 1.57 which is really good I think. my computers 0-60 time read consistent 3.1. My new Hellcat barely has in beat at consistent 2.9!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
I feel that all the catch cans and stuff are not needed . I prefer to have 45 minutes of work before going to the track to change to "off road". The pcv valve atop the manifold gets vented instead of piped to the intake which gets plugged ( 30 seconds). The OTHER oil source, AKA knock retard, for the intake is the crank case vent tube to the air box. I remove it and plug the box and vent the tube which by the way is on the oil intake so I wind up being able to add oil without removing the shaker scoop, (5 minutes) . I than do my current best settings ( another 10 minutes). I keep a ryobi impact, a 100 lb torque stick, and a torque wrench for good measure close by and change out my wheels (30 minutes). I buy the vp additive and put 1/2 quart to a 1/4 tank of 93, that should be 101 to 103 octane. Logging shows no knocks or retard with the additive compared to some, but almost no (below .5 degrees and rare) s/t knock retard with 93 alone.. Now we shall do a 101 octane tune and report.

My last thought is as follows....the cai by dodge has three holes 1.shaker, 2. front light, and 3.bottom triangular...two of which are scooped. The Chrysler 300 has a duct attachment which fits the same triangular air-box bottom and can be adapted to make a third scoop. This means it becomes true ram air. Boom Badda Bing! When the car moves....its creating positive flow.

Any thoughts, comments, and or comments or thoughts.

Tell us about your ho-made innovations, cheaps, and hacks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Hit the track tonight . Cecil Dragway. Had high 11 and did a full nelson on a Camaro.
978099

Did a little better on another run.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
413 Posts
Don, nice homework and results for sure! Congrats on the sweet times. I would personally use reflective heat tape rather than tin foil.....or even possibly a battery blanket. I run the hellcat air box that is insulated with about 3/8" of spray rubber on the entire outside.

I cannot wait for cooler temps (hopefully next month) to get back at it. My best last year was 11.68 with 77 degrees and 1700+ DA. Looking for low 11's this year.

Keep up the great work Don...... nice posts and a bad ass Hot Rod....Gene:)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,293 Posts
Loved the Camaro kill, he got the jump on you too so it must have beee especially hard to swallow when you drove around him :)

Funny how you say a catch can is not necessary, but you mimic the effect of one by disconnecting the hoses??? Why let it gum up your intake for all other driving except for when you are making 1/4 mile passes?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Loved the Camaro kill, he got the jump on you too so it must have beee especially hard to swallow when you drove around him :)

Funny how you say a catch can is not necessary, but you mimic the effect of one by disconnecting the hoses??? Why let it gum up your intake for all other driving except for when you are making 1/4 mile passes?
The point exactly, the catch can simply retains the pollution control aspect by eliminating MOST oil that causes the k-retard, but still allows the vapors. The second hose from the oil fill to the air cleaner never gets mentioned. The shaker scoop has two water drain holes approx 1/4 inch sticking out the bottom of it. Both vents are next to the vent filters left and right but not a direct connection. I checked this morning and both vents are as dry as a bone this morning. BTW..I'm told for reasons of crank case pressure build from boosted engine in a properly running engine, its best to have positive crank case venting, so this would only apply to NA, not a blown engine. (At least that's what I'm told).

The foil looking coating is hvac insulation and yes its reflective (heat) on both sides. We tried aviation grade aluminum reflective tape and it was to squirly to manage in the crevices and wouldn't stick to the plastic.

As to the air intake........ there is an effect ....which name eludes me with my 1st coffee...whereas air passing at high speed across something like a strait tubes sticking up from a carb could actually cause a vacuum...hence the scoops we see atop them. I'm wondering if the two out of three inlets being "ramed" going into the air box and the third not being....does this cause air restriction, via vacume at the filter. Remembering the goal is not to provide high speed air....but a good supply of ready air thats not fighting the intake... if that were the case the third bottom hole would be better off sealed or scooped vs. opened, as that 3rd unrammed hole would provide an exit for the rammed air...and high speed air at the filter vs. simply putting relative pressure or less of a vacume, into the air box . I'm not sure about your hellcat but me thinks if you have a 3rd hole for intake aside from the headlight tube and hood scoops....and its not scooped....this might be worth exploring. My hole premise with all my air box chatter is ...I do not believe that a straight airflow can be achieved at high velocity/pressure directly into the intake at the TB. The best I will achieve is a positive pressure for the intake to draw from vs waste or worse a vacuum airbox pressure. At any rate...we shall see. Kind of like creating sea level in the mountains. Combine that with a ventured TB and you can move some air. ( before the smart ass's comment.....this may very well be a windmill requiring 2 more digits, after the decimal, to be on a time ticket to see the differences.....but....what the hell! ).

In my personal work today...we are chasing down a nasty little pressure air leak that's howling at us from the blower side of a cat c-13 engine in one of my trucks when the duel turbos are under a load and above 1700. We first thought it was in the waste gate circuit but ....no banana. I have to go in and push that along. I'm looking for my Louisville Slugger at this moment

BTW...B Woody is in my neighborhood. I may do some suspension stuff with them.

Last night was fun. I will probably go again Friday and play with some tunes as the track has extended t/t on Friday. I was playing with a 100 proof ( with VP additive) Hemifever tune I got yesterday but I reverted to the 93 Hemifever tune for the Camaro kill @ 11.98 with a nights best of 11.86 as the 100 tune would only do ~12.1 at best. I'll drop Sean a note and later do some logging and send him all the info so he can play with it. I used the launch control all night. and 16 lbs in the mt's on 17's. The only thing pissing me off was the New Jersey guys keep closing the track when some rice falls from their cars.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
447 Posts
I feel that all the catch cans and stuff are not needed . I prefer to have 45 minutes of work before going to the track to change to "off road". The pcv valve atop the manifold gets vented instead of piped to the intake which gets plugged ( 30 seconds).
Not cool that you vent your PCV ...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
447 Posts
Acid...why is it not "cool"? Isn't track......"off road" ?
I'm just saying man, we already drive massive displacement cars - may as well not also spray oil mist everywhere you drive lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
I'm just saying man, we already drive massive displacement cars - may as well not also spray oil mist everywhere you drive lol
OK. ILL KEEP IT IN THE GARAGE AND BUY A TESLA. ( please ignore the power plant running 24/7 so the Tesla has power available for 1/2 hour a day.

All kidding aside... if an engine is spewing oil every where its got a problem with wear and doesn't need to be on a track period, much less on the highway. Most oil through the catch can is vacuumed from the orifice at the pcv and would not escape if not for the fact that vacuum is present at the pvc. My concern was the fumes...not oil....into the intake during off road use. Them hamsters and frogs will live. BTW....ever wonder what that smell is when you do a burnout......its called burning rubber...and it emits hydrocarbons, shall we put a plastic device over the car so fumes from tires is captured? What about heating the track...does it cause a global warming hot spot...and a famine in some far away land from the 0.000000000000000003 micro degree increase in global temperature caused by a burnout? I don't think so....but if you had read my post carefully, "The shaker scoop has two water drain holes approx 1/4 inch sticking out the bottom of it. Both vents are next to the vent filters left and right but not a direct connection. I checked this morning and both vents are as dry as a bone this morning.", you would have seen reference to ( two holes on the bottom of the shaker...which when running vacuum air into the shaker scoop...and the vents...one right and one left...are located at these holes...providing a passive affect the same as the hose does without the vacuum causing the oil siphoning problem. This is standard on boats. Boats are also off road.

( I know I'm picking on you....but you asked a question and I'm sharing my thoughts........THANKS FOR ASKING ! )
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
61 Posts
Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Loved the Camaro kill, he got the jump on you too so it must have beee especially hard to swallow when you drove around him :)

Funny how you say a catch can is not necessary, but you mimic the effect of one by disconnecting the hoses??? Why let it gum up your intake for all other driving except for when you are making 1/4 mile passes?
That's a very good question!!!! Hmmm...let me think on it. Now I ask you a question....does the catch can simply catch liquid oil siphoned from the engine.....or does it also condense vapors into liquid? My whole thing is about vapors into the intake manifold. At least mitigating them. You question makes me wonder ..."is there more"? Blow on glasses and you'll get what I mean. Looking forward to any answers or thoughts on this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
447 Posts
OK. ILL KEEP IT IN THE GARAGE AND BUY A TESLA. ( please ignore the power plant running 24/7 so the Tesla has power available for 1/2 hour a day.

All kidding aside... if an engine is spewing oil every where its got a problem with wear and doesn't need to be on a track period, much less on the highway. Most oil through the catch can is vacuumed from the orifice at the pcv and would not escape if not for the fact that vacuum is present at the pvc. My concern was the fumes...not oil....into the intake during off road use. Them hamsters and frogs will live. BTW....ever wonder what that smell is when you do a burnout......its called burning rubber...and it emits hydrocarbons, shall we put a plastic device over the car so fumes from tires is captured? What about heating the track...does it cause a global warming hot spot...and a famine in some far away land from the 0.000000000000000003 micro degree increase in global temperature caused by a burnout? I don't think so....but if you had read my post carefully, "The shaker scoop has two water drain holes approx 1/4 inch sticking out the bottom of it. Both vents are next to the vent filters left and right but not a direct connection. I checked this morning and both vents are as dry as a bone this morning.", you would have seen reference to ( two holes on the bottom of the shaker...which when running vacuum air into the shaker scoop...and the vents...one right and one left...are located at these holes...providing a passive affect the same as the hose does without the vacuum causing the oil siphoning problem. This is standard on boats. Boats are also off road.

( I know I'm picking on you....but you asked a question and I'm sharing my thoughts........THANKS FOR ASKING ! )
Cool.
 

·
Registered
2016 Scat Pack Shaker
Joined
·
605 Posts
The Don, 11.61 with only a tune, DR's, augmented street gas and some IAT reduction is excellent. 1.51 60' is outstanding. ( My best is 11.558 with a 1.661 60') A little weight reduction, seat removal and skinnies on the front should get you solidly in the 11.5"s.

I'm only seeing an occasional spike of .5 to 1 degree KR but just reviewed a couple of logs and confirmed it knocks the crap out of actual spark. This is the first discussion I have seen related to reducing KR by reducing oil vapors entering the combustion chamber. Very Interesting.
 

·
Super Moderator
2016 SXT Plus Blacktop
Joined
·
15,741 Posts
That's a very good question!!!! Hmmm...let me think on it. Now I ask you a question....does the catch can simply catch liquid oil siphoned from the engine.....or does it also condense vapors into liquid? My whole thing is about vapors into the intake manifold. At least mitigating them. You question makes me wonder ..."is there more"? Blow on glasses and you'll get what I mean. Looking forward to any answers or thoughts on this.
The whole idea of a catch can is to condense the oil in the vapor to capture it in the can. There isn't liquid oil just flowing through the pipes. Sure some condenses on the wall of the tube, but that's why catch cans have grids, screens, filters, etc. to separate the fuel, oil, and other contaminants out of the air/gases flowing through the PCV system.

A Guy
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
413 Posts
Perfectly said Guy. That's the whole reason I installed my Moroso Can and unplugged / capped my breather hose from the valve cover to the Manifold. Before the can install....the TB was wet with oil droplets. Now...dry as a bone.
 
1 - 20 of 85 Posts
Top