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Discussion Starter #1

This is the main highlight for us:

"ZF has confirmed that mass production of its fourth-generation of its 8-speed automatic will begin in the 2022 calendar year. The supplier also announced that FCA has asked it to deliver its new 8-speed transmission for its rear-wheel-drive and all-wheel-drive vehicles with front-longitudinal drive configuration (or front-engine, rear-wheel-drive based platforms). So why is this important? The all-new fourth-generation 8-speed automatic is expected to play a big part of the plug-in hybrid electric vehicle (PHEV) and mild hybrid electric vehicle) (MHEV) lineup within the FCA portfolio, including the L-Series (Dodge Challenger and Dodge Charger) replacements which are slated to begin production around the same time frame."

So it looks like the next-gen Challenger will have some sort of mild hybridization. I realize some will shake their head in disgust at that, but I for one welcome it, as long as it's a reliable system. Something like the existing eTorque would be cool. Whatever helps these modern muscle cars get better gas mileage with our big old V8's and keep beating the government's fuel economy mandates. And the hybridization may even have performance benefits as well. So, I say why not?

Although, its probably important to realize that at least one of the two NA V8's will probably be going away soon, likely replaced by the Tornado turbo-I6. My money is on the 5.7, while the 392 will likely receive some major updates (hopefully).

Here's the other highlight:

"The newest version of the 8-speed automatic will still have four planetary sets and five sets of shift elements, which means it will continue to be an ultra-reliable transmission while it is evolving and being improved. The highly anticipated 48-volt electrified MHEV version is expected to have a ranking between 440 lb.-ft (597 Nm) and 735 lb.-ft (997Nm) of torque available."

So not only will we have hybridization, it looks like the next gen 8 speeds will be just as robust, if not more so, than the current gen. I'd be over the moon if they gave us NA guys a transmission that can easily take more than 510 lb ft. of torque, like the HP70 does.

Thoughts?
 

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I wonder if it can be fitted into the 15+ models with the current 8 speed along with E-Torque.
With this part: The all-new fourth-generation 8-speed automatic is expected to play a big part of the plug-in hybrid electric vehicle (PHEV) and mild hybrid electric vehicle) (MHEV) lineup within the FCA portfolio, including the L-Series (Dodge Challenger and Dodge Charger) replacements which are slated to begin production around the same time frame."

I'd expect that something gets a re-worked under the skin (and floorpan) to accommodate some sort of e-Torque setup since its indicating the replacement for the L series which looks like MY 2023 is when that may happen.

If it was something that could have been a running change - it was more a matter of ZF delivering the newer design 8 speed unit.

When it becomes a significant engineering exercise, typically a more comprehensive redesign of the vehicle is part of that.
 

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I have no interest in electric anything electric especially in a performance sports car. This is a retro throwback car and that’s why I bought it. It looks great, goes fast, makes real engine and exhaust sounds and has a manual transmission.
Put a fork in it, it’s time to call it a great run and be done with it.
It’s a Challenger not a Tesla.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have no interest in electric anything electric especially in a performance sports car. This is a retro throwback car and that’s why I bought it. It looks great, goes fast, makes real engine and exhaust sounds and has a manual transmission.
Put a fork in it, it’s time to call it a great run and be done with it.
It’s a Challenger not a Tesla.
I get it man, but no one said we're losing our V8's. It'll still have the rumble, the sound, the torque. This technology is just going to make it more economical, and maybe even aid in the performance.
 

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I’m new to this current ZF Torqueflite marvel. Hard to improve on in my opinion. Amazing and intuitive technology. There are some interesting YouTube’s on it.
 

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I have no interest in electric anything electric especially in a performance sports car. This is a retro throwback car and that’s why I bought it. It looks great, goes fast, makes real engine and exhaust sounds and has a manual transmission.
Put a fork in it, it’s time to call it a great run and be done with it.
It’s a Challenger not a Tesla.
I disagree. I will always take "more". Same car, tons more torque, more efficiency, better cost/mile, save the endangered hairy chested nutscratchers, all wins. I also assume, more money as well.
The one downside of electric/hybrid/assist systems, I also assume no clutch pedal, but since this is about the next gen A8 I guess that doesn't come into play anyway. And if you are going to go hybrid/assist setup, a Challenger is the best platform. It always makes a car heavy and compromises space, so go with something that a couple hundred pounds won't matter, and has plenty of extra space.
 

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People are still fighting the e-diff in the new C8 and the new supras. It may be able to calculate better, but it's unpredictable. Takes the decision out of the drivers hands
 

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I disagree. I will always take "more". Same car, tons more torque, more efficiency, better cost/mile, save the endangered hairy chested nutscratchers, all wins. I also assume, more money as well.
The one downside of electric/hybrid/assist systems, I also assume no clutch pedal, but since this is about the next gen A8 I guess that doesn't come into play anyway. And if you are going to go hybrid/assist setup, a Challenger is the best platform. It always makes a car heavy and compromises space, so go with something that a couple hundred pounds won't matter, and has plenty of extra space.
As long as there is a manual option with the clutch pedal and shifter I will be happy, even if there is a larger battery and smaller engine. To me, no third pedal = “less.” Less driver engagement and less fun. Numbers on a page don’t mean much. There will always be faster cars than mine.
 

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As long as there is a manual option with the clutch pedal and shifter I will be happy, even if there is a larger battery and smaller engine. To me, no third pedal = “less.” Less driver engagement and less fun. Numbers on a page don’t mean much. There will always be faster cars than mine.
I’d be willing to bet money it will be like the corvette and bye bye man pedal.
We all have different likes, dislikes, needs and wants. I bought this car to waste fuel, make lots of noise and out a smile in my heart and on my face.
These cars aren’t purchased for gas mileage or any other conservation issue.
Let the Challenger end it’s life as it is and not just be in name only.
As I’ve said my son works for Tesla and they pay him extremely well but he said they is zero fun in them, they are pin you in your seat fast but after a few dozen runs he said he will keep his Jeep, truck and motorcycle.
I asked if he’d buy one and he said eh, it’s not an inspirational driver.
 
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This is another confirmation that the new Challenger will debut in 2022.

"ZF has confirmed that mass production of its fourth-generation of its 8-speed automatic will begin in the 2022 calendar year....The all-new fourth-generation 8-speed automatic is expected to play a big part of the plug-in hybrid electric vehicle (PHEV) and mild hybrid electric vehicle) (MHEV) lineup within the FCA portfolio, including the L-Series (Dodge Challenger and Dodge Charger) replacements which are slated to begin production around the same time frame."
 

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The fact dodge hasn't implemented any type of "auto rev match" for the manual cars....along with a 700hp engine they are sticking in everything these days, I have hope they will keep the 6 speed.


As far as I know the Viper is still 100% manual so unless they want to change they're whole approach to sports cars, there is still hope
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
The fact dodge hasn't implemented any type of "auto rev match" for the manual cars....along with a 700hp engine they are sticking in everything these days, I have hope they will keep the 6 speed.


As far as I know the Viper is still 100% manual so unless they want to change they're whole approach to sports cars, there is still hope
The next Viper will likely have an automatic or dual clutch option, to be more competitive with the Corvette. There's a reason Dodge didn't sell a ton of Vipers, aside from them being really expensive. Many of us find manuals annoying in traffic, or want to go faster with an automatic. There should be an option for both tastes, which will help keep the Viper around, if they can sell enough.
 

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The only electric car im interested in is one that i tell it where to go and it takes me there without me driving it.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
The only electric car im interested in is one that i tell it where to go and it takes me there without me driving it.
Good thing the new Challenger won't be fully electric then

I really don't think mild hybridization is anything to be feared or shunned
 

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As far as I know the Viper is still 100% manual so unless they want to change they're whole approach to sports cars, there is still hope
I thought the Viper died in 2017? Or am I misunderstanding?
 

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I thought the Viper died in 2017? Or am I misunderstanding?
It did, but there is talk about bringing out a new Viper. Or maybe a Barracuda. Something to take the top spot Halo sports car position.
 

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It has been a trend to have the electric assist turning up in Ferrari, Acura, McLaren and Porsche models

and with the costs of technology coming down, (almost like Moore's Law) these technologies will appear in the mainstream.

This probably spells out more of the trend of smaller displacement ICE powertrains paired up with electric assist.

That being said - the value of my '16 SPS has increased that much more to me - the M6 is the most "analog" driving experience comparable to the feel of the muscle cars of my past.

As I had said many times in the past, if there was no manual - I wouldn't have bought a Challenger and picked something else.

the .2 difference in the quarter mile with the A8 isn't relevant to me in the day to day or when I'm out on the twisty back roads or in the mountains. That's how I use mine.

It will be interesting to see how things develop - but having my '16 is my "last one" for me.

Whatever the future brings, I'll follow it and learn of it. But if its only automatic - that's not for me.
 
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It has been a trend to have the electric assist turning up in Ferrari, Acura, McLaren and Porsche models

and with the costs of technology coming down, (almost like Moore's Law) these technologies will appear in the mainstream.

This probably spells out more of the trend of smaller displacement ICE powertrains paired up with electric assist.

That being said - the value of my '16 SPS has increased that much more to me - the M6 is the most "analog" driving experience comparable to the feel of the muscle cars of my past.

As I had said many times in the past, if there was no manual - I wouldn't have bought a Challenger and picked something else.

the .2 difference in the quarter mile with the A8 isn't relevant to me in the day to day or when I'm out on the twisty back roads or in the mountains. That's how I use mine.

It will be interesting to see how things develop - but having my '16 is my "last one" for me.

Whatever the future brings, I'll follow it and learn of it. But if its only automatic - that's not for me.
I suspect that Dodge will do whatever is necessary to keep a manual around as at least an option in the next gen car. They know what they have with the Challenger, it's a retro throwback. That necessitates a manual option.
 
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