Dodge Challenger Forum banner

1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I have moved to a location that does not have E85 within what I consider a reasonable driving distance (>20 miles).
I can re-tune it to run on 93 but was wondering if I can run octane booster without damaging the plugs or causing any issues with the motor.
I'll have to pull the timing back to ~20* for 93 vs 25 with E85, but with the booster I should be able to prevent any KR (the reason I switched to E85) and add a few more degrees of timing.
I have also thought about getting a storage container (50 gal drum maybe?) and using the truck to refill the container as needed. I would be able to fill up at home but the 50 gallon drum would only last for about 3 fill ups...and it would be a PITA to load & unload the drum with the cherry picker.
I am looking at about a 10-15 rwhp loss between the corn vs the petrol, I'm not sure I'll notice it much in a 4000+ lb vehicle but it still bothers me.
Any ideas?
 

·
Super Moderator
2016 SXT Plus Blacktop
Joined
·
17,852 Posts
I don't have your answer, and suspect you have done this, but just in case






A Guy
 
  • Like
Reactions: chizzle1

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,438 Posts
I have moved to a location that does not have E85 within what I consider a reasonable driving distance (>20 miles).
I can re-tune it to run on 93 but was wondering if I can run octane booster without damaging the plugs or causing any issues with the motor.
I'll have to pull the timing back to ~20* for 93 vs 25 with E85, but with the booster I should be able to prevent any KR (the reason I switched to E85) and add a few more degrees of timing.
I have also thought about getting a storage container (50 gal drum maybe?) and using the truck to refill the container as needed. I would be able to fill up at home but the 50 gallon drum would only last for about 3 fill ups...and it would be a PITA to load & unload the drum with the cherry picker.
I am looking at about a 10-15 rwhp loss between the corn vs the petrol, I'm not sure I'll notice it much in a 4000+ lb vehicle but it still bothers me.
Any ideas?
To deal with the move from E85 to E10 or even ethanol free 93 I would think requires more than just finding a way to bring the octane back up to E85 level.

The engine controller along with the fuel system is geared towards ensuring the engine is properly fueled when running E85.

Is the engine controller going to be able to adapt to the presence of no ethanol and fuel the engine properly? And with injectors that are sized to deliver the copious amounts of E85 required?

Octane boosters like Boostane use I believe MMT for raising the octane of the fuel into which it is added.

MMT coats the plugs and combustion chamber surfaces with an orange deposit. Not sure what (if any) negative effects this causes. But generally engine deposits are not a good thing.

And have you researched how much Boostane you'll have to use to bring pump gas octane up to where you want it, where the engine needs it?

I'm thinking the cost might make that 20 mile run for E85 the lesser or the two evils.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
15,564 Posts
You'll get deposits on the plugs, so their service life will be reduced

if this is your daily drive (I believe it is...) you'll probably run with regular pump gas as you won't be in the track environment going full-out and street driving might clean up the deposits from octane booster
 
  • Like
Reactions: chizzle1

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,438 Posts
and they will ship it to you.

The only quantity that makes sense for a car's E85 fuel needs is the 55 gallon barrel which costs $6.50/gallon not including shipping.

Say the drive 40 mile round trip for E85 costs 2 gallons of E85. That's quite a bit less cost than buying E85 mail order.
 

·
Registered
2015 Challenger SRT
Joined
·
717 Posts
Torco always turned my plugs orange...Not on the Challenger, but on another that I used as an Octane Booster...
 
  • Like
Reactions: chizzle1

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Thanks for the replies.
To deal with the move from E85 to E10 or even ethanol free 93 I would think requires more than just finding a way to bring the octane back up to E85 level.

The engine controller along with the fuel system is geared towards ensuring the engine is properly fueled when running E85.

Is the engine controller going to be able to adapt to the presence of no ethanol and fuel the engine properly? And with injectors that are sized to deliver the copious amounts of E85 required?

Octane boosters like Boostane use I believe MMT for raising the octane of the fuel into which it is added.

MMT coats the plugs and combustion chamber surfaces with an orange deposit. Not sure what (if any) negative effects this causes. But generally engine deposits are not a good thing.

And have you researched how much Boostane you'll have to use to bring pump gas octane up to where you want it, where the engine needs it?

I'm thinking the cost might make that 20 mile run for E85 the lesser or the two evils.
There is no fuel type sensor on my vehicle, it was not designed to be a flex fuel vehicle.
I use HPtuners to adjust the fuel management to enable running E85, the fuel mass at WOT will need to be reduced by roughly 12% when switching back to 93 to prevent a rich condition. When I planned the build (a few years ago now) I purchased 52# injectors - large enough to handle the 10% increase in fuel on the corn, but small enough to run 93 reliably.

Agreed about engine deposits, the E85 has run pretty clean the last few years, no black build up on the exhaust outlets since the switch.

I'm not attempting to get the 93 up to the 108 rating of E85, I'm will have to dial the timing back (as mentioned in post #1) to run 93, with or without octane booster.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
The only quantity that makes sense for a car's E85 fuel needs is the 55 gallon barrel which costs $6.50/gallon not including shipping.

Say the drive 40 mile round trip for E85 costs 2 gallons of E85. That's quite a bit less cost than buying E85 mail order.
I would burn 2 gallons there and 2 gallons back, roughly 1/3 of a tank. It gets 11 all the time.
I am not paying almost $400 for 55 gallons of fuel, free shipping or not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
You'll get deposits on the plugs, so their service life will be reduced

if this is your daily drive (I believe it is...) you'll probably run with regular pump gas as you won't be in the track environment going full-out and street driving might clean up the deposits from octane booster
Thankfully I have the beater (03 Corolla - rated in squirrel power) to run back and forth to work in.
I enjoy driving the Challenger, but it's been relegated to weekend duty.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
at the end of this tank it will go back to 93...sucks but it is what it is.
Once my oldest is done with college maybe I can afford a maggie to make up for the lost 10-15 hp :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,438 Posts
at the end of this tank it will go back to 93...sucks but it is what it is.
Once my oldest is done with college maybe I can afford a maggie to make up for the lost 10-15 hp :)
Probably the best solution. Didn't realize the car would only get around 10mpg on E85. That makes that 40 mile trip to get E85 a pretty expensive trip.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
I will never bash variable valve timing again, allows you to make power also conserve fuel when cruising.
The 7.0 is thirsty all the time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,173 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
made the switch to 93...I don't like, the car don't like it. Seems to be running a little lean at part throttle, and idle is rough-er than before. I may need to tweak the fuel mass...
I'll run a tank through it to see if it improves.
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top