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Discussion Starter #1
ok so we have all heard of the new updated hellcat specific lifters , that are made stronger with larger needle bearings and better oiling . well the truth is that there is no such thing . hellcat's use the same lifters as all hem's from 05 and up . yes all new mopar lifters are revised improved and fit all. there are 2 part numbers with much different cost for NON MDS,first is 5038787AC (AD NOW) this part number seems to be phasing out and the cost is around $100 for ONE lifter only ! it fits everthing from 5.7 05-up,6.2 (hellcat) 6.4.
the 5038784AC (NOW AD) this is what i believe is the new part number (still in transition) this number is available and fits all 5.7 05-up,6.2 (hellcat) and 6.4 05-up. the cost is substantially less a set of 4 with yokes is about $90-150 depending . i just got in 4 sets (16 lifters 4 yokes (5038784AD) for $325 + 15 shipping.
now for the funny part MOPAR part numbers .
on the new lifters there is a part of a part number on them ,i mean a the last 5 is 787AD yes thats the last 5 of this number 5038787AD I really have to laugh . see all pics .
one thing i would love to compare these to a liffter with part number 5038787AD to see if theres a real difference but im certain there is not. what i would really like to see is it compared to an older lifter and see if the size of the needle bearings are larger . so if you have an old one take a look at it and see how many bearings you can see at the base of the ears , check my pic i can only see one full and 2 halves of the needle bearings.
thanks for reading.
976722
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Discussion Starter #3
you guys were contacted by phone a few weeks ago by a member both part numbers were given ,your reply was " i have know idea " :rolleyes: im looking for the exact quote you told him it was posted seems to have disappeared since they updated the site .
 

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many people in parts, regular people and 4 or 5 total gear heads, many revisions, but same across the board

976728


for example first page of the many pages that the lifter fits
 

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Discussion Starter #6
yes i know that very well , but the answer is still not answered , what is the diff between the 2 5038787AD & 5038784AD , you guys were asked that directly by phone ,the reply was i have no idea . so since you guys did not know i continued my research. there is no difference other then the part number . 5038787AD is going away many dealers say its on national back order . the other number 5038784AD is avalible . this is the same as 5038787AD .
787AD its printed on the new lifter in a box with part number 5038784AD .
 

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Discussion Starter #10
yes , i found this out during my research.
5038787AD 1 lifter average cost $45-65
5038784AD 4 lifters and yoke (complete rack ) average cost $ 89-100
big difference in cost

the 5038784AD is a complete rack in contains 4 of the 5038787AD lifters and 1 of 53021721AA
this is what i discovered in my research. i did this because i like everyone elese was confused on the 2 part #'s we all thought they were 2 different lifters and one of them was hellcat specific. in the beginning me and a few members were trying to figure this one out but nobody had the answer .one guy did in fact call you guys and was told they didnt know .not saying it was you but that was the response . i called my dealer and they didnt know either . so i began to find out the deal. i went to my dealer and he pulled a 5038787AC AND WHAM it was one lifter.
and that was the diff in part #'s . so that was cleared up. now i wanted to solve the notion and speculation on "hellcat lifters" and discovered theres no specific lifter for it .they all use the same ones.

the question i need answered is what is the difference in the 787AD lifter compared to the older lifters superceded ones such as 53021720AC; 53021572AA; 53021720AB; 53021720AA; 53021720AD; 68060699AA; 05038686AA .
im looking for an engineering change larger needle bearings ? better oiling ? beefier design ?

this is the debate that circulates on all hemi forums .everyone is talking about "new hellcat lifters" thus my post . there is no such thing as a specific hellcat lifter . im only trying to see exactly what the engineers did on this newer lifter design or if in fact they are still using the original design. there are even vendors selling lifters calling them hellcat lifters. this just fuels the controversy .
this is all the reasoning behind my post and i have a few.
thanks for reading . i do have another engineering question on a spec not sure if you guys can answer it or not .let me know.
thanks
 

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yes , i found this out during my research.
5038787AD 1 lifter average cost $45-65
5038784AD 4 lifters and yoke (complete rack ) average cost $ 89-100
big difference in cost

the 5038784AD is a complete rack in contains 4 of the 5038787AD lifters and 1 of 53021721AA
this is what i discovered in my research. i did this because i like everyone elese was confused on the 2 part #'s we all thought they were 2 different lifters and one of them was hellcat specific. in the beginning me and a few members were trying to figure this one out but nobody had the answer .one guy did in fact call you guys and was told they didnt know .not saying it was you but that was the response . i called my dealer and they didnt know either . so i began to find out the deal. i went to my dealer and he pulled a 5038787AC AND WHAM it was one lifter.
and that was the diff in part #'s . so that was cleared up. now i wanted to solve the notion and speculation on "hellcat lifters" and discovered theres no specific lifter for it .they all use the same ones.

the question i need answered is what is the difference in the 787AD lifter compared to the older lifters superceded ones such as 53021720AC; 53021572AA; 53021720AB; 53021720AA; 53021720AD; 68060699AA; 05038686AA .
im looking for an engineering change larger needle bearings ? better oiling ? beefier design ?

this is the debate that circulates on all hemi forums .everyone is talking about "new hellcat lifters" thus my post . there is no such thing as a specific hellcat lifter . im only trying to see exactly what the engineers did on this newer lifter design or if in fact they are still using the original design. there are even vendors selling lifters calling them hellcat lifters. this just fuels the controversy .
this is all the reasoning behind my post and i have a few.
thanks for reading . i do have another engineering question on a spec not sure if you guys can answer it or not .let me know.
thanks
honestly nearly impossible to get engineering to tell what exactly they changed, changes occur all the time, revision, vendors change, etc, Im not sure what the differences are, not sure that except for a couple of people, if anybody knows

what I can say, we have abused and seen abused camshaft and lifters, rocker shaft etc with little to no failures......do failures occur in the real world, yes, I beat the engine in Bigred to and on the redline repeatedly, nearly 3 years and never had a camshaft issue, lifter issue etc, and we were using old part number lifters

I think people are over thinking this, and when you build high horsepower and if you are racing aggressively you will eventually have failures, nothing is bullet proof

be glad to try to answer any questions, if we dont know will say so and will reach out to people we know on the inside
 

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Discussion Starter #13
yes i compared my old original ones from 09 ,and it looks like the needle bearings are larger and fewer of them. all mine looked brand new as well as the cam .i did a 6.4 cam in my 5.7 . i had a bad lifter but it wasent the bearings that failed it was just intermittent tapping loud at times .it failed internally and wasnt pumping up or holding pressure . i thought it was wiping the cam and and spreading metal throughout the engine .why i did the cam swap ,man does it move now over 4k and revs up to 67k . .johan did my tune .and i have a wideband so its super easy to tweak . 0-60 in about 4 sec and 1 was 3.9 sec.
 

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Welcome to Challengertalk ;) Good luck with that!

A Guy
 

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Back when I was installing the 6.2 cam I kept seeing posts about using HC lifters but what I found back then was 5.7, 6.2, 6.4 used the same lifters...and more.

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Could it be that people associate HC lifters with non-MDS and hence say to use HC lifters?
 
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