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They don't have to fit under the fender...

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A Guy
 

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My parents visited me for Christmas and I let them use my Scat. I told them to be careful and that it was a street legal race car that would get sideways on you in a hurry. They came back later and my 84 year old mother said to me "You're right - it will get sideways on you in a hurry!"
😂
 

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A good set of tires and some rear suspension parts will help!


- Alexis
 

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I have been considering going to a 315 also with new wheels (I have the WRT wheel). Please do let us know how much of an improvement they are and if they stick out past the fender. Those look like Invo's. I would bet even in the same size they would at least marginally grip better than the Pirellie's. However, I have noticed many performance tire tread patterns seam like even though its the same tire the tread pattern is better with the wider tire (IMO), and 1.5" more width helps too.

My only concern with wider tires is added unsprung weight. Wondering how much that effects 30-100mph. The WTR is a pretty light wheel.
The best I can figure by looking up weights on the net is this wheel(aftermarket
10.5 replicas/tire(315/35 nitto invos) combo will add 7 to 8lbs per wheel over the stock setup with 9.5" wide oem hellcat wheels and the 275/45 pirelli pzero neros.
 

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2019 Challenger Scat Pack
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I have a manual trans in my SP and if I floor it in second with the clutch fully engaged I can't get the stock tires to spin at all while on good asphalt... And, yes, tcs is off. From what I am reading here, this is not normal. Do I have a lemon or what?
If you are going straight and your moving along pretty good, you might not spin in second. These people are talking about launching from a stop.

If you try to do a 0-60 run with your car...good luck launching without wheel spin!
 

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2018 Scat Pack SHAKER in Plum Crazy
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Do the math
with some rounding to simplify...
rear 3.1, 1st gear 4.7 = 14.57
multiply the torque, lets lowball it at say 350 lower revs, some losses... = 5100 pound/feet
divide by the radius of the tire in feet (about 1.2?) = 4250 pound feet. Yes the car has enough torque to basically accelerate as if falling off a cliff, and it only gets worse as you get closer to torque peak.

static friction of normal tire rubber on asphalt is less than .8 so multiply the weight of the rear times .8 and you end up with way over twice the force that the tire can handle. There is not a tire on the planet that will hold that traction in 1st gear. Unless, you launch with rolling the power on just right, with great tires with great suspension setup and get weight transfer and dang near lift the front end. Or, just take it a bit easy until 3rd gear...
 

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To no ones surprise, our Scat Packs have terrible traction when launching from a stop. This is typical of high HP muscle cars but I feel like it's excessive with the SP (the R/T and SRT suffer the same). I want to start a thread on what people have done to alleviate this issue on and off the track. Seeing the 1320 gives me hope that getting decent traction in the SP is possible. I think Dodge set up the Scat Pack to handle well (which they do IMO) and missed the mark with launch traction. The lack of lateral traction is so bad.

I'm interested in what others have done for better traction on the street when launching from a stop but I know some of what is done on the drag strip will transfer to the street. If your sick of your wheels spinning when you don't want them to, feel free to complain her as well.

In many peoples opinion the 245 tire is much to skinny for any muscle car, and I agree 150%. It's a joke that Dodge put these tires on our cars (and even worse that they put skinnier tires on the R/T). I put a set of 275/40R20 Gforce Comp-2s and it helped but I'm still not happy. I have been considering running DRs in the back when the weather is good but don't know if that will help much on the street. I don't think 275 is wide enough for 485hp. The issue is, I like the stock wheels but 275 is the widest you should go on a 9" rim. If I do change wheels I'm thinking about going to an 18" wheel. It will make the ride softer, should make launch traction better, but will decrease cornering stability. I'm not road racing on a track so the latter isn't really an issue.

Questions:
  • Would the difference in traction be worth the cost of all new tires and wheels if going to an 18" rim?
  • Could I go with 305/45x18 (10" or 11" rim) on the back and 245/55x18 in the front? Concerns are an 18" wheel fitting over the front brakes and the rear tire height. I don't know how picky the electronics are with rear tires being off a bit, 0.1" in this case.
  • If I'm putting on new tires and wheels are there other sizes that will improve traction that will fit with less compromise?
  • Go 315 in the back and just have the tire stick out?
  • What sizes have you all used on your Scat Packs (non-wide body) and had success with adding a noticeable amount of traction?
  • Has anyone ever widened the stock rear wheels to fit a wider tire? I would go 315 and not care about the rim sticking out, but I think it wold scrape on the inside without a spacer depending on how the did it. (I have zero knowledge about widening wheels, I read it online so it must be true, lol.)
Upgrading your tires should helps but there has to be more. The Challenger has most of it's weight in the front so weight transfer would help, but how do you do that and make the car drive-able as a DD? Softer springs/struts in the front with a softer sway bar, plus reactive dampers in the rear? The SP suspension is some what stiff so lightening the front shouldn't hurt much on the street.

In terms of launching, other than tires/wheels and suspension, is there something else I'm missing?

I just really want better lateral traction. It's my DD so it's gotta drive good on the road. Not looking for race car handling, just livable on my drive to work. Don't get me wrong, smoking tires easily is fun, but I would prefer more traction. Have a nice day.
Are you trying to launch in the winter or summer?

The only time i can't get grip when the light turns green is on wet streets, even with the Extreme Contacts.

I know the Extreme Contacts stick when the roads are hot, but lose some of it in the winter even thought they are all season UHPs.

I run 245s, and get grip whenever i launch out on a dry road. Sport Mode is even better.

The Extreme Contacts aren't as great I expected as I've worn them out after 17,000 miles

I'm gonna try the new Goodyear Eagle Exilarates.
 

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2018 Challenger R/T Scat Pack 6.4 WK
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Discussion Starter #32
I have only had the car for one season, winter season, and now into the cold spring. There have been a few 70-74 degree days, I still feel like traction could be better. I found a shop that specializes in suspension for racing so I'm gonna take my car in and get some advice from the experts.
 

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I haven’t yet tried that but sounds like it should help. Racer X tried that in a video and as I recall it helped. As the weather warms here in the cold northwest I think my Firehawk Indy 500s will grab better also.
 

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Discussion Starter #35
Start in 2nd gear, best solution on the street.
I have tried that and absolutly get from 0-60 faster when starting in 1st and feathering the gas. I got a tazer and plan to play with the shift points to see if delaying the first shift helps or if advancing it help.

Even starting in 1st, leaving TC on, WOT from zero MPH and letting TC do it's work still gets me better 0-60 than starting in second.

Starting is second is good for traction not acceleration.

Not trying to be argumentative, we just need to bust that myth.

Better tires/wheels and suspension tuning is what I plan to do. Staggered tires and wheels with 315/35R20 in back, 1320 springs, adjustable rear suspension parts to get proper camber/toe/etc (might just start simple with a camber bushing), then an alignment to get the rear tires as flat as possible, probably 0.5 on the camber. It might take some time but I will report back once done.

As for the tazer, I swear track mode has less ESC/TC than sport mode. The car feels much more powerful even on the freeway. I wonder if it removed the adaptives along with removing TC. Anyone know about that. Im going to do a write up on the tazer once I've had it a while. People experiences are different so I figure it might help someone out.
 

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I have tried that and absolutly get from 0-60 faster when starting in 1st and feathering the gas. I got a tazer and plan to play with the shift points to see if delaying the first shift helps or if advancing it help.

Even starting in 1st, leaving TC on, WOT from zero MPH and letting TC do it's work still gets me better 0-60 than starting in second.

Starting is second is good for traction not acceleration.

Not trying to be argumentative, we just need to bust that myth.
...
Oh, I don't doubt that. And results will vary with M6 vs A8, and A8s with different rear ratios.
2nd will limit you, probably too much. But if you can't practice enough to feather the gas well enough on the street, you won't "sit and spin" when the urge hits you to pull out quick. When I am in traffic (or with a sensitive passenger (wife)) and want to pull out quick, but not look like a jerk, I use 2nd.
 

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36 posts about traction. The car COMES WITH a way to measure it - 0-60 times.
Nobody is talking about data, just ideas, theories and assumptions.
🤣

How about a 3.6 on the street?
3.4 on the track?
4.1 on the original 245 RSA-2?
 

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2018 Challenger R/T Scat Pack 6.4 WK
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Discussion Starter #38
My purpose of the thread in the first place was for people to complain, maybe Dodge will be listening, and for people to throw out ideas and things they have done to combat the lousy traction.

More complaining but I understand why. Most put on new tires and say good enough because it helps a lot. But I want more.
 

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Why complain? It boils down to, "My car has too much power, what do I do? " Don't floor it in first, problem solved, if slippery shift up and don't floor it.
 

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My purpose of the thread in the first place was for people to complain, maybe Dodge will be listening, and for people to throw out ideas and things they have done to combat the lousy traction.

More complaining but I understand why. Most put on new tires and say good enough because it helps a lot. But I want more.
I don't thinks Dodge monitors this thread. The stock tires they put probably meet the required specs. But each customer is different and soon learns to shed their stock tires. If Dodge put $300 tires on them and that would raise the price a $1200 on MRSP.

I know a guy with a Scat pack that uses Walmart brand tires. Half the price of Eagles, Continentals and Pilots. He wil probably replace his tires at the same intervals we do with Eagles, Continentals and Pilots.
 
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