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When you read this check out the photos of the 3 cars and you tell me which is hands down the best looking - Challenger just crushes them all and is the clear winner. Such a good looking muscle car!
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/aut...enger-what-we-know/ar-AAEeTOh?ocid=spartandhp
Yup.....hard to disagree.

But even if you do.........just pick the one you like, buy it and give that middle finger to the future.

Enjoy 'em while they are available in their current form.
 

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Funny that he defines pony/muscle cars as:

"Two-door American coupes and convertibles with virtually unusable rear seats, usually referred to as pony cars or muscle cars and considered sports cars by some, have long been a hard sell in the U.S. market."



But fails to point out the elephant in the living room with a more than usable rear seat and superior trunk space along with stellar exterior design. Which is why I, personally, don't consider the Challenger to be in the same class of car as the other two.
 
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Funny that he defines pony/muscle cars as:

"Two-door American coupes and convertibles with virtually unusable rear seats, usually referred to as pony cars or muscle cars and considered sports cars by some, have long been a hard sell in the U.S. market."



But fails to point out the elephant in the living room with a more than usable rear seat and superior trunk space along with stellar exterior design. Which is why I, personally, don't consider the Challenger to be in the same class of car as the other two.
In the end that won't matter much.

To quote Danny Devito, as "Larry the Liquidator", from
other People's Money.

"At one time there were lots of Buggy Whip makers.....when change came the last to go probably made the BEST DAMNED BUGGY WHIP anyone ever saw"

The story is not much different and it's in your article too.

Just as horse driven carriages went away and as such so too did the need for buggy whips..........it didn't matter how GREAT that last one for sale was.

Same true here.

As people seem to want more SUVs and trucks.......the sales of cars and especially 2 door coupes is steadily declining to the point where soon all of the existing available models will have to change dramatically or just go away entirely in favor of something that is more in demand and profitable for the auto manufactures to produce.

Like that LAST AVAILABLE buggy whip suggested in the movies as "best you ever saw", the Challenger might just be the best of the 3 and that may set it up as the last to go away.........but the smart bet still says, "if you want one before they are gone.......you might want to buy sooner rather than wait 'till later when they are probably gone.

A bigger slice, all to yourself, of a market in steady decline is still no way to run a successful business and it's still a recipe for lost profit oppeortunity no company will ever willingly accept.
 

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Time marches on and the next "pony cars" will be electric. Performance cars are not going away even if they are a small segment. The performance will be amazing and as battery tech gets better and better, range will be near 400 mi. The new Jaguar XJ sedan is all electric and it was a V12 for many years. But, for us dinosaurs, a V8 with a manual transmission will always have a strong appeal even if the electric cars blow it away- which they will.
 

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Two things interested me in the article. First, that the new Challenger will likely debut in 2022. And, second, that the long-rumored Barracuda- a pet project of Ralph Gilles- was actually planned for 2010.

The smaller Challenger was supposed to migrate to Alfa Romeo's rear-drive Giorgio platform, but delays and added cost in developing that platform put it on ice.
 

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Funny that he defines pony/muscle cars as:

"Two-door American coupes and convertibles with virtually unusable rear seats, usually referred to as pony cars or muscle cars and considered sports cars by some, have long been a hard sell in the U.S. market."



But fails to point out the elephant in the living room with a more than usable rear seat and superior trunk space along with stellar exterior design. Which is why I, personally, don't consider the Challenger to be in the same class of car as the other two.
In the end that won't matter much.

To quote Danny Devito, as "Larry the Liquidator", from
other People's Money.

"At one time there were lots of Buggy Whip makers.....when change came the last to go probably made the BEST DAMNED BUGGY WHIP anyone ever saw"

The story is not much different and it's in your article too.

Just as horse driven carriages went away and as such so too did the need for buggy whips..........it didn't matter how GREAT that last one for sale was.

Same true here.

As people seem to want more SUVs and trucks.......the sales of cars and especially 2 door coupes is steadily declining to the point where soon all of the existing available models will have to change dramatically or just go away entirely in favor of something that is more in demand and profitable for the auto manufactures to produce.

Like that LAST AVAILABLE buggy whip suggested in the movies as "best you ever saw", the Challenger might just be the best of the 3 and that may set it up as the last to go away.........but the smart bet still says, "if you want one before they are gone.......you might want to buy sooner rather than wait 'till later when they are probably gone.

A bigger slice, all to yourself, of a market in steady decline is still no way to run a successful business and it's still a recipe for lost profit oppeortunity no company will ever willingly accept.
Being in decline doesn’t automatically mean an eventual disappearance.

“Industry executives don’t anticipate buyers will swing back to sedans en masse. But analysts say demand for crossovers and SUVs is topping out amid a broader slowdown in U.S. auto industry sales, and the market share for these models isn’t likely to grow too much beyond its current size.

‘The piece of the pie is about set,’ said Jeremy Acevedo, an analyst for Edmunds.com.”

https://www.wsj.com/articles/suvs-a...-dealer-lots-with-more-on-the-way-11562491801

Look at the chart of quarterly growth for SUVs, it’s quickly approaching 0. Currently SUVs make up 47% of the new vehicle market and based on the growth chart, probably will top out somewhere around 50% of the market, assuming for SUV’s benefit, that we don’t get hit with a recession. No automakers are going to be willing to give up completely on the remaining 30% of the market that aren’t interested in an SUV or a truck. Especially if as the article says, profit margins on SUVs start shrinking due to market saturation. Even after Chevy and Ford cancelled all those cars they still kept around the Mustang, Camaro, Malibu, and a few hatchbacks. Similarly, the only cars FCA has left are the three from Brampton and the few from Fiat and Alfa that sell at near rounding error rates in the US. I certainly don’t see FCA rolling out a bunch of new cars anytime soon, but I don’t think they’re going to suddenly decide to completely exit the car segment either. There’s still money to be made there. Money they’ll need when SUV profit margins start shrinking.
 

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Being in decline doesn’t automatically mean an eventual disappearance.
The goober said "A bigger slice, all to yourself, of a market in steady decline is still no way to run a successful business and it's still a recipe for lost profit oppeortunity no company will ever willingly accept."
But yet, The Challenger sales keeps increasing every year, According t stats on Wikipedia anyway, 2018 was highest ever, and over a half million over 10 years.
Camaro out sold Challenger, but declined since 2015 and less last year. Very similar to Mustang's sales, if that trend continues, Dodge will be the leader.
 

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The challenger does look the best.

Its a shame that both the Mustang and Camaro went away from the retro styling, that brought them both such great success.

The Mustang is starting to grow on me, but I still much prefer the look of the Challenger.

I wont say that the Camaro is terrible, but its not in the same class, (style wise) as the other two.
 

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The goober said "A bigger slice, all to yourself, of a market in steady decline is still no way to run a successful business and it's still a recipe for lost profit opportunity no company will ever willingly accept."
But yet, The Challenger sales keeps increasing every year, According t stats on Wikipedia anyway, 2018 was highest ever, and over a half million over 10 years.
Camaro out sold Challenger, but declined since 2015 and less last year. Very similar to Mustang's sales, if that trend continues, Dodge will be the leader.
Yup and that may extend the time during which you can get one.........but without a reversal in the general trend for the category........the Challenger is as dead as the Camaro it's only a matter of time before massive change comes to the name plate or it is mothballed in favor of better use for the factory that produces the car.

In no way am I saying the car goes away in the next year or two.......but the trend for the category is UGLY and capturing a bigger share of a market in indisputable overall decline is unsustainable.

If for no other reason than to avoid the opportunity cost of building this car instead of something that sells better and is in bigger demand, assuming this declining sales trend for the over all category continues, it's only a matter of "when" not "if" the Challenger turns into something we wouldn't recognize as a Challenger or it just goes away.

Right now......sad to say it.......but this is setting up EXACTLY as Devito's fictional character in the movie described that last buggy whip maker. The Challenger is beating both Ford and Chevy in sales......proving that the Challenger is today's pony car leader for sure. It's the one "in demand" vs it's direct competition. The problem is found in how each year there are less buyers to compete for. Mean-while those JEEPS and Ram Trucks are competing for share in a growing market.

There are people, you can bet your last dollar on this, at Chrysler who are already at least thinking the way people at Chevrolet are as they suggest the factory capacity devoted to the Camaro could be put to more productive and profitable use.

Ford announced already the plan to discontinue all cars EXCEPT the Mustang..........yet no one who likes that car should rest easy over that decision. After ditching all other cars in favor of the Trucks and SUVs people clearly prefer it's not hard to imagine that a couple more years worth of decline could see an iconic brand like the Mustang on the Chopping block as well.
 

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The goober said "A bigger slice, all to yourself, of a market in steady decline is still no way to run a successful business and it's still a recipe for lost profit opportunity no company will ever willingly accept."
But yet, The Challenger sales keeps increasing every year, According t stats on Wikipedia anyway, 2018 was highest ever, and over a half million over 10 years.
Camaro out sold Challenger, but declined since 2015 and less last year. Very similar to Mustang's sales, if that trend continues, Dodge will be the leader.
Yup and that may extend the time during which you can get one.........but without a reversal in the general trend for the category........the Challenger is as dead as the Camaro it's only a matter of time before massive change comes to the name plate or it is mothballed in favor of better use for the factory that produces the car.

In no way am I saying the car goes away in the next year or two.......but the trend for the category is UGLY and capturing a bigger share of a market in indisputable overall decline is unsustainable.

If for no other reason than to avoid the opportunity cost of building this car instead of something that sells better and is in bigger demand, assuming this declining sales trend for the over all category continues, it's only a matter of "when" not "if" the Challenger turns into something we wouldn't recognize as a Challenger or it just goes away.

Right now......sad to say it.......but this is setting up EXACTLY as Devito's fictional character in the movie described that last buggy whip maker. The Challenger is beating both Ford and Chevy in sales......proving that the Challenger is today's pony car leader for sure. It's the one "in demand" vs it's direct competition. The problem is found in how each year there are less buyers to compete for. Mean-while those JEEPS and Ram Trucks are competing for share in a growing market.

There are people, you can bet your last dollar on this, at Chrysler who are already at least thinking the way people at Chevrolet are as they suggest the factory capacity devoted to the Camaro could be put to more productive and profitable use.

Ford announced already the plan to discontinue all cars EXCEPT the Mustang..........yet no one who likes that car should rest easy over that decision. After ditching all other cars in favor of the Trucks and SUVs people clearly prefer it's not hard to imagine that a couple more years worth of decline could see an iconic brand like the Mustang on the Chopping block as well.
Again, your assumption is that the car segment will continue to shrink, which is not expected to be the case according analysts in the article I linked. The move to SUVs by a large number of consumers is now fizzling out. Many of them won’t move back to cars any time soon, but the market for people wanting cars is not going to go to zero or close to it. There will always be people out there who prioritize performance and styling over utility. There will also be people out there wanting a cheap vehicle, which SUVs are not. The comparison to horses and carriages of old is a bit out of place because there is comparatively little difference between a car and SUV compared to a car and a horse and buggy.
 

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Even if some form of the Challenger is retained, in the future, it won't feel the same because it will most likely be powered by a quiet electric motor.
 

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One thing's for certain, the used market will be absolutely saturated with SUVs for a long time. There will be so many to pick from, and they'll be dirt cheap with poor resale value. And yet, I still won't buy one.
 

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One thing's for certain, the used market will be absolutely saturated with SUVs for a long time. There will be so many to pick from, and they'll be dirt cheap with poor resale value. And yet, I still won't buy one.
Same here 100%. Life's too short to drive a boring vehicle.

On a side note lets say all 3 are around for another 50 years. Now that all 3 can be had with a supercharged V8 which manufacturer will be the first to offer a turbocharged V8.
 

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Cadillac :)

https://media.cadillac.com/media/us...s/news/us/en/2018/mar/0321-twin-turbo-v8.html

Twin Turbo V6 maybe. Top HP Porsche 3.8L Biturbo is 690 HP, 553 LB-FT

Mercedes offers an auxiliary electrically driven supercharger that spins a compressor for low RPM torque to prevent the normal turbo lag until the turbo spins up

Once you "fix" the turbo lag issue, turbos more efficient, better fuel economy

https://www.autoblog.com/2018/08/24/hennessey-f5-reveals-1600-hp-aluminum-twin-turbo-v8/

A Guy ;)
 

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Same here 100%. Life's too short to drive a boring vehicle.

On a side note lets say all 3 are around for another 50 years. Now that all 3 can be had with a supercharged V8 which manufacturer will be the first to offer a turbocharged V8.
^ I like this guy! 100% correct!
 
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