Dodge Challenger Forum banner
  • Hey everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part of this month's Ride of the Month Challenge!

41 - 54 of 54 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,434 Posts
Gotcha. Another thing that throws us when trying to figure out how much a mod accomplishes is that the programming seems to vary per MY. I've seen guys post pics of the icons they got in 2011 or 2012 and it's not exactly what I get on my 2013.

My feeling is that the only way to kill the nannies entirely is to do what powertec did, i.e. cut power to and from the DSS. The other solutions, be it factory or even aftermarket, probably don't go that far for liability reasons. If someone got into a major wreck with no ABS they might contend that the disclaimers for off-road use were in too fine a print or confusing and hit the jackpot or be off the hook.
Now as far as the percentage of reduction we've been getting via various means... up in the air, as you said. I felt that the key trick on my old Charger was closer to 100% than from 50%, and a little more than what I get with my NoESP Challenger, but who really knows? The cars we're talking about should be driven side by side and one after the other to be sure.
 

·
Registered
2012 challenger srt
Joined
·
1,951 Posts
The key trick for an SRT is esp 80% off, this mod is 100% off. I'm not sure what the RT key trick is, I think it's 50% for the 09-12's and 80% for the 13's like the srt. The mod does throw a CEL. The beauty of this mod is that there is no loss of power from the traction control/ABS. I dont have mds so I'm not sure if that has any effect on it but I dont beleive it does, there are guy's drifting RT's using this mod. I'm going to try to get a decent set of instructions and some pictures of my install to simplify this for others and to povide a visual of what to expect.
traction control and the ABS system are two different things. disabling the ESP dose not disable the ASB system. Not your post but some one said that they could smell their rear brakes while doing a burn out with a line lock and they thought it was because of the ESP being disabled. Some of you have no idea how a line lock works.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
628 Posts
Discussion Starter #44
traction control and the ABS system are two different things. disabling the ESP dose not disable the ASB system. Not your post but some one said that they could smell their rear brakes while doing a burn out with a line lock and they thought it was because of the ESP being disabled. Some of you have no idea how a line lock works.
Actually it was me that smelled my rear brakes after using my line lock. I completely understand how line lock works and disabling the YAW sensor with this mod does disable ABS. I didn't think the brakes were burning because ESP was disabled, it was because ESP wasn't completely disabled. ESP/traction control will use the brakes to intervene when it thinks the car is skidding out of control, for instance a burnout with line lock applied, the car is pretty damn confused at this point. Line lock only locks the front brakes leaving the rears free to spin until... ESP steps in to save the day, and applies the brakes mildly to the spinning tire(s), unless 100% disabled. It's not enough to stop the burnout, easily overcome, but enough to smell. I no longer smell my brakes after a good line lock burnout, it use to stink up my garage for hours, long after the smell of burnt rubber was gone, two very different and very distinctive smells IMO. Here's a helpful link about ESP in regards to the use and intervention of the brakes as ABS is one component of the traction control system. ESP: Electronic Stability Program - Automotive technology, innovation and engineering
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,434 Posts
And here's another poster who disabled ESP to avoid frying his rear brakes on a dyno:
I found on a dyno run that even with it shut off completely it still has the ability to activate, mine started to smoke the rear brakes in the middle of a run. At the track the way to completely shut it off is to pull the abs pump fuse. My last time at the track I ran 3 runs between 13.28 and 13.31 with the button method and upon pulling the fuse I ran a 13.11 and a 13.10 with no other changes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,402 Posts
pulling the abs fuse seems to be the ticket?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,160 Posts
Actually it was me that smelled my rear brakes after using my line lock. I completely understand how line lock works and disabling the YAW sensor with this mod does disable ABS. I didn't think the brakes were burning because ESP was disabled, it was because ESP wasn't completely disabled. ESP/traction control will use the brakes to intervene when it thinks the car is skidding out of control, for instance a burnout with line lock applied, the car is pretty damn confused at this point. Line lock only locks the front brakes leaving the rears free to spin until... ESP steps in to save the day, and applies the brakes mildly to the spinning tire(s), unless 100% disabled. It's not enough to stop the burnout, easily overcome, but enough to smell. I no longer smell my brakes after a good line lock burnout, it use to stink up my garage for hours, long after the smell of burnt rubber was gone, two very different and very distinctive smells IMO. Here's a helpful link about ESP in regards to the use and intervention of the brakes as ABS is one component of the traction control system. ESP: Electronic Stability Program - Automotive technology, innovation and engineering
I thought I pulled a bonehead move and fried my clutch one day after a long and satisfying burnout. Turned out to be my brakes apparently doing the same thing you describe here. The smell lasted all day. I was legitimately worried for my clutch.
 
  • Like
Reactions: powertec

·
Registered
Joined
·
636 Posts
I've been searching and can't find the answer I'm looking for, so please forgive me for reviving this thread(at least I didn't start a new thread). Anyways I will be getting on a dyno this weekend (first time on a dyno) with my 13 R/T auto to get a baseline. Do I need to kill TC when running on a dyno? If I hold the button down it doesn't change anything and I haven't tried the key trick since I always have the push button in. I did notice when loading a new tune last night that there's an option to disable TC on my Trinity. Will that kill it 100% or enough for the dyno pull without any ill effects?
 

·
Premium Member
2013 RT Classic
Joined
·
537 Posts
The key trick does not work on a 13 Auto RT, I have one. I did go with the NO ESP mod from Z automotive, Z Automotive Technologies I think it basically is the same as the switch but it allows you to use the ESP button you already have just as everyone else that can turn off the ESP does. A long press of the button turns everything off. Well as off as it is going to be without digging further.

As for the Dyno, I can't see how it makes a difference either way. The rear end of the car runs on the Dyno and the front wheels are tied down. As the car is a RWD only, the car thinks it is driving down the road. I guess I could be wrong but I don't see how. I grew up on the 60s and early 70s cars without all the nanny systems. I don't see why there is all the fuss about instant disaster if you turn the systems off. Heck our DRIVERS TRAINING cars in High School were powered by 351 Cleavlands and 4BBl carbs and no nanny systems.

With all that said, I drive with it on about 99% of the time but hey, when I want it off, the car should let me turn it off, I hate Gbmt mandated safety because I am "too stupid to know what is good for me".
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
636 Posts
Thanks for the reply. The dyno run went well without even discussing traction control. I did order the NO ESP module and a TranZformer but haven't got around to installing them yet. Joe said he figured out the 13+ burnout mode and line lock so I'm kind of waiting for a firmware update.
 

·
Premium Member
2013 RT Classic
Joined
·
537 Posts
Cool about the firmware update, I will be looking for it. I have both the Tranzformer and the No ESP, both work very well and I have no problems with either..... well except for the user manual LOL, things like the cruse control stalk are mentioned for activating features on the Tranzformer and, well, as you know, we do not have a cruse control stalk, it is built into the steering wheel. Otherwise, it works great!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
142 Posts
Subscribe
 
41 - 54 of 54 Posts
Top